JBL's Map Making Help Service

[JBL]

[size=24pt]JBL's Map Making Help Service

_________________________________________________I ntro

I'm not scared to say that I'm a professional starcraft map maker because it's simply true.. it probably sounds pretencious.. but.. it's for your own good because I'm here to help you. I can help with Triggers, Briefings, Locations, Concepts, Units Placement, Balancing, Testing, Ideas, or simply ask me a question.

_________________________________________________H ow does it work

First of all, I need informations about your map so I can help you.. If you request some help.. start by telling me these basic informations:


1 - What kind of help you need exactly.

2 - What the map is about (Defense, Offense, Bound, Micro, Melee, Madness, Turn Based Game, Puzzle, RPG, etc.. if you aren't sure, describe it a little..)

3 - Number of human AND computer players in the map. (this is important for the triggers)

4 - Your skill level in map making.. (So I know what kind of vocabulary to use and how details to give.)


That's about it.. If I feel like I need more information, I'll edit the post.

_________________________________________________P ayment

Yeah I'm doing this free.. but feel free to donate and/or  :powerup:

[Zeratul]

We had one person already ask for help on a map. Good to see someone volunteering for this ^_^.
:powerup:

I would help out as well but I rarely have the time + I have a lot of gaps in my knowledge about map making.

[JBL]

We had one person already ask for help on a map. Good to see someone volunteering for this ^_^.
:powerup:

I would help out as well but I rarely have the time + I have a lot of gaps in my knowledge about map making.


yeah.. time is the major flaw.. but.. with the years.. I can do pretty much any trigger job in 20 minutes.. and everything that is not about triggers takes about 1sec so..

[Zeratul]

Map making is something I'm looking forward to when SC2 is released I must say. Just seeing the new options makes me think happy thoughts ^_^

Maybe I'll have more time to do things when I finish school..

[JBL]

Map making is something I'm looking forward to when SC2 is released I must say. Just seeing the new options makes me think happy thoughts ^_^

Maybe I'll have more time to do things when I finish school..


map making takes so much time.. i've waste so many hours to be fast like I am today..

btw I do all my triggers in pure text format...

Suppose I gotta do a trigger engine.. I do the inital trigger in semi text format in starforge.. then use Scmdraft2 to have it in txt.. and i copy paste in a .txt and thats how I do my triggers.. at the end all i have to do is copy paste it back in scmdraft2, save and open the map again in starforge.

[Zeratul]

Starforge trigger maker huh. I have to say I'm much too noob for that. I've always just used SCXE for my triggers because I don't have to remember the exact coding for each thing. Even then I don't know how to do certain things because of the fact that I don't know all the trigger functions. Never really used Scmdraft2 much.
I can see how you could do stuff fast the way you do it compared to SCXE's way.

[JBL]

Starforge trigger maker huh. I have to say I'm much too noob for that. I've always just used SCXE for my triggers because I don't have to remember the exact coding for each thing. Even then I don't know how to do certain things because of the fact that I don't know all the trigger functions. Never really used Scmdraft2 much.
I can see how you could do stuff fast the way you do it compared to SCXE's way.


I did start with SCXE.. I started slowly... it took a while to be fast with triggering...

I remember the last map I made with scxe.. it was a super big project.. some arena map with spells.. and I had to click so many times to duplicate every triggers.. u know.. you gotta copy every triggers made for P1 for the 5 other players...

it took me a few days.. lol

and now I would do it in about 20 minutes per player.. even if there are about 100+ triggers per player..

in the .txt you can do ctrl+f to find the values that you have to change.. so it's really fast

[Zeratul]

Yeah the duplication of triggers is a time waster for sure.

[JBL]

Yeah the duplication of triggers is a time waster for sure.


the hardest part is when your trigger engine (what I mean by trigger engine is.. sometimes what you want to do is so complex that you need like 20-30 triggers just to do one thing in the map.. it's called a trigger engine) has to be copied for every players with dozens of values that you gotta change.. like.. the locations, players, units, in both the conditions and actions..

that's why after a while, you learn to use less locations, less units, etc.. I could do a map with only 1 location.. many have done it before.. I didn't do it because it's easier to have like 5 to 10 locations...

most of the time I start with 5-10 and at the end.. I add some locations just to do the job quickly.. and to make sure it doesnt interfer with the 5-10 main locations that does everything...

[Zeratul]

What type of maps are those which you would use 5-10 locations on?
I find that even with the simplest of triggers and trigger engines (2 or 3 triggers associated with each other for instance) that I am prone to make a mistake somewhere even if it is VERY small it always mucks the whole thing up and takes a while to find.

[JBL]

What type of maps are those which you would use 5-10 locations on?
I find that even with the simplest of triggers and trigger engines (2 or 3 triggers associated with each other for instance) that I am prone to make a mistake somewhere even if it is VERY small it always mucks the whole thing up and takes a while to find.


I wish SEN was up.. I could show you a map I made with about 5 locations or so.. and it looks like a 1 000 locations map to some people..

with 1 location I could make ANY map.. anything can be made with only 1 location.. but it's dumb to only use one.. I always use at least 1 per player.. per trigger engine... If i truely finish a map with everything in it and all (I mostly do arena and turn based game maps) I will probably end up with 20 locations...

the key is.. the locations CAN MOVE!

you need death counters and switches..

death counters are so versatile.. they act like switches AND/OR timer.. so the possibilities are endless... the only thing a death counter can't do unless you do a whole new trigger is randomness.. but all you need a randomization trigger with switches.. then you make the actions to randomize some death counters.. and there you go

[Pix]

1 - What the map is about (Defense, Offense, Bound, Micro, Melee, Madness, Turn Based Game, Puzzle, etc.. if you aren't sure, describe it a little..)
It's sort of an infiltration map - players have to move through the station and eliminate opposition.

2 - Number of human AND computer players in the map. (this is important for the triggers)
Three human players, five computer players.

3 - What kind of help you need.
Right, I'm trying to import some sound onto the map - but when I try and use the sound importer in StarEdit it says "Make sure the folder is not read-only" or something. I've made sure the folder where my .WAV files are in isn't read only... but it still won't work. A little help?

4 - How much time you have to waste on a map... (is this just a quick 3-4 hours map.. a huge project?)
I'm probably going to spend quite a few hours on this, something to keep me occupied over the summer holidays.

~Pix~

[PowerkickasS]

Hey JBL, can you teach me about hyper triggers? I've had way too many bugs getting one fixed lol

[JBL]

1 - What the map is about (Defense, Offense, Bound, Micro, Melee, Madness, Turn Based Game, Puzzle, etc.. if you aren't sure, describe it a little..)
It's sort of an infiltration map - players have to move through the station and eliminate opposition.

2 - Number of human AND computer players in the map. (this is important for the triggers)
Three human players, five computer players.

3 - What kind of help you need.
Right, I'm trying to import some sound onto the map - but when I try and use the sound importer in StarEdit it says "Make sure the folder is not read-only" or something. I've made sure the folder where my .WAV files are in isn't read only... but it still won't work. A little help?

4 - How much time you have to waste on a map... (is this just a quick 3-4 hours map.. a huge project?)
I'm probably going to spend quite a few hours on this, something to keep me occupied over the summer holidays.

~Pix~


1 - Hmm is that rpg-like.. hmm like you have 1 ghost and maybe a spellcasting system or something like this..? it's important that I know what you are making so I know how to think in order to help you.. I think it's some kind of rpg/team strategy with 1 unit per player right?

2 - Ok now I need to know if you REALLY need all these 5 computers ACTIVE in the map.. having all the slots used makes it hard to make a good map.. I'll explain why once I answer powerkickass's question..

3 - First of all I would start by using a real map editor.. Xtra editor 5 is a good choice.. try getting it @ www.staredit.net (i think the site is down right now.. or else i would give a direct link.. I might add a small section with links in the initial post..) This is some kind of problem that is probably more computer related than map making related.. I've never seen this before.

Try putting your files in another folder... but I'm pretty sure Xtra Editor will fix ur problem.

[JBL]

Hey JBL, can you teach me about hyper triggers? I've had way too many bugs getting one fixed lol


What? what is a hyper trigger? lol?? I don't know what it is..

LOL .. I'm just kidding..

Hmm what you should do is.. delete your hyper triggers and do exactly what I'll tell you..

First of all.. you need a computer player.. that is in the game.. but that you won't use.. that means.. a computer player with a start location.. no other units, no other triggers.. no other use at all... that's where you'll place your hypers.. The reason we need this computer player is because the hyper triggers WILL mess with every other triggers under the same player/force.

So you probably know how to do a hyper.. but i'll just explain it here. (I use the starforge way for the triggers)

Condition:
Always();
Actions:
Comment("hypers");
PreserveTrigger();
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
... (in fact, you want 62x Wait(0); because the maximum number of actions is 64)

once this is done, copy your hyper trigger 2 more times.. so you have 3 hypers.. this is more than enough.. in fact I think 2 would be ok.. but I always made 3..

I'm pretty sure you had problems with your hypers because they were in a used computer slot..

Ohhh.. one more thing.. most of the bugs in a map are due to the use of wait triggers.. I remember when I started.. that was really a major problem.. it always messed up my maps.. you shouldn't use the wait action at all unless you know exactly what you are doing..

To create a "wait" without using the action.. here's what you can do..

I'll do a simple trigger using a "wait".. and then.. the way to do it without using any "waits"

Condition:
Always
Actions:
Wait X
Create a marine at Location X for Player X
Preserver Trigger
Comment


ok now here is the way to do it without a wait... you need 2 triggers.. they can be in separate players.. it might look weird.. but trust me.. it's uber 1337

Condition:
Death count for Academy for Player Y is exactly Y
Actions:
Create a marine a location X for Player X
Set Deaths for Academy for Player Y to ZERO
Preserve Trigger
Comment

//////////////////////////////
2nd trigger:
/////////////////////////////

Condition:
Always
Actions:
Add 1 Death of Academy to Player Y
Preserve Trigger
Comment




Ok.. I used Academy because it's one of the first (probably the first) unit alphabeticaly.. and in starforge.. it's just easier.. but you HAVE TO PICK A UNUSED UNIT IN UR MAP.. don't worry there are so many.. in extended map editors.. there are units that make the map crash.. you can even use these as death counters.. any unit will work.. it's a just a way to keep track of the triggers..

and how is this a wait?

everything the 2nd trigger runs.. it adds 1 death to academy... and it runs like once every x milliseconds (sry I don't remember.. I used to be sooooo leet I would tell you exactly but.. I can't remember.. I know the information is on Staredit.net.. anyway.. just test to know how many deaths you want it to wait..

so.. once it reachs X deaths.. (lets say.. 30) the trigger will laugh.. and it will reset the 2nd trigger by setting it to ZERO death...

try it.. you'll see.. that's how all the pros do their wait triggers.

[PowerkickasS]

:powerup: well earned
scoreboard counter > spider mine counter

[JBL]

:powerup: well earned
scoreboard counter > spider mine counter


so.. it did fix your map??

when you use death counters all the time.. you'll see.. your map won't bug anymore.. the only bugs what will happen are those like.. you accidently put location X instead of Y in a trigger.. and as soon as you test the map you realise what you did and you go fix it.. no more frustrating: "WTF IS THAT?"

[PowerkickasS]

so.. it did fix your map??

when you use death counters all the time.. you'll see.. your map won't bug anymore.. the only bugs what will happen are those like.. you accidently put location X instead of Y in a trigger.. and as soon as you test the map you realise what you did and you go fix it.. no more frustrating: "WTF IS THAT?"


Nope, I still haven't touched it for ages =P
But I can trust your expertise lol. Your advice was very logically anyhow.
The map that's infected with a few timing bugs (which doesn't really affect gameplay anyways. most major bugs had already been fixed) has no leftover slots, and I just can't be bothered finishing it =/
I'll definitely put your idea in practise if I ever continue making a few more maps. Atm I've started and kinda hoping to complete a series of 'racecraft' maps. A type of competitive racing map with a vulturebike which includes ideas like actual obstacle boundaries that would damage/destroy your bike in contact, multi-courses, SFX obstacles, special item inventory (like mario kart battle), skill systems, upgrades etc, but I bet, like with all my other ideas, I'd probably wouldn't finish either. Maybe I should learn your way of making, with starforge (it really OMFGs my computer >.<)

If you want I could send you my work in progress, and do you still have any of your creations? I always like trying people's new maps =P

[JBL]

I know nothing about map making, but seems you are very kind to offer this! Will you be making maps for starcraft 2 as well? Perhaps you can make the first bunker wars for starraft 2 and get it as popular as dota is for warcraft ;D


Bunker Wars can't get as popular as dota.. because dota has a super duper replay value.. there are so many heroes and items.. and the way the pvp is made makes it the best use map setting map ever.. forget about a madness map being as popular.. most of the time.. madness are played by noobs.. and I'll probably not make maps for Starcraft 2.. I don't make maps for Warcraft 3 and the way the maps are going to be programed is probably going to be the same.. i'm sure this is THE reason why Starcraft 1 will be played after starcraft 2 is released..

[JBL]

so.. it did fix your map??

when you use death counters all the time.. you'll see.. your map won't bug anymore.. the only bugs what will happen are those like.. you accidently put location X instead of Y in a trigger.. and as soon as you test the map you realise what you did and you go fix it.. no more frustrating: "WTF IS THAT?"


Nope, I still haven't touched it for ages =P
But I can trust your expertise lol. Your advice was very logically anyhow.
The map that's infected with a few timing bugs (which doesn't really affect gameplay anyways. most major bugs had already been fixed) has no leftover slots, and I just can't be bothered finishing it =/
I'll definitely put your idea in practise if I ever continue making a few more maps. Atm I've started and kinda hoping to complete a series of 'racecraft' maps. A type of competitive racing map with a vulturebike which includes ideas like actual obstacle boundaries that would damage/destroy your bike in contact, multi-courses, SFX obstacles, special item inventory (like mario kart battle), skill systems, upgrades etc, but I bet, like with all my other ideas, I'd probably wouldn't finish either. Maybe I should learn your way of making, with starforge (it really OMFGs my computer >.<)

If you want I could send you my work in progress, and do you still have any of your creations? I always like trying people's new maps =P


I've lost many of my maps.. and most of them were mostly experimental and doesn't worth playing.. However my best map is hosted on www.staredit.net.. browse for Reflector 2

its for 2-4 players.. If someone is interested I could host it sometimes... but.. I'm very busy these days.. I just moved and I got a lot of stuff to do...

[SmirkySmirker]

i'm a "pro" mapmaker as well

pretty skilled as far as triggers go

and i've been known to make some awesome melee maps

but i do it for myself haha

[SmirkySmirker]

i could send you a couple if you'd like

they're not popular (it's impossible to get a melee map to be popular when all anyone plays is bgh or fastest) so you wouldn't recognize them by their names

[Zeratul]

I've lost many of my maps.. and most of them were mostly experimental and doesn't worth playing.. However my best map is hosted on www.staredit.net.. browse for Reflector 2
its for 2-4 players.. If someone is interested I could host it sometimes... but.. I'm very busy these days.. I just moved and I got a lot of stuff to do...

You made Reflector 2 O.o.
I know that map, triggers are more advanced than anything I could do for sure. Was quite fun as well.
I believe www.staredit.net has actually ceased as a site. Read it in a post on another forum.

I would personally think that map making on SC2 will be different. There are a lot of exploits or glitches or whatever that programs like Starfore and scxe use to make better maps.
Maybe a lot of the things will be the same, same trigger system for instance but I still think there will a lot more options and oddities to play around with.

[JBL]

I've lost many of my maps.. and most of them were mostly experimental and doesn't worth playing.. However my best map is hosted on www.staredit.net.. browse for Reflector 2
its for 2-4 players.. If someone is interested I could host it sometimes... but.. I'm very busy these days.. I just moved and I got a lot of stuff to do...

You made Reflector 2 O.o.
I know that map, triggers are more advanced than anything I could do for sure. Was quite fun as well.
I believe www.staredit.net has actually ceased as a site. Read it in a post on another forum.

I would personally think that map making on SC2 will be different. There are a lot of exploits or glitches or whatever that programs like Starfore and scxe use to make better maps.
Maybe a lot of the things will be the same, same trigger system for instance but I still think there will a lot more options and oddities to play around with.


wow it's nice to know that you've heard of my map.. (I would say "one of my maps" but.. well reflector 2 is my lil baby I'm simply too proud of it)

I don't think Reflector 2 could be made for starcraft 2.. because I'm almost sure the map making for SC2 will be like WC3... bye bye conceptual maps..

Reflector 2 could have been made in the original editor.. beside the squarish terrain... everything else is doable in the original blizzard made map editor.. but it would take more hours of work.. but it's pretty doable..

and trust me.. there is going to be a starforge like software for SC2 too.. there are some for WC3..

What is your high score (in one turn) at reflector 2? Mine is 38 or 39.. I cant remember..

and you are saying Staredit.net DIED??? HOW THE HELL??? wow wow wow How could staredit.net die? wow.. that's sad... the death of the best online gaming community I've ever known...

[PowerkickasS]

DoS attack ftl? X_X

[SmirkySmirker]

anyways, as far as triggers go

i made Kirby Bound for the Kirby- clan
annd, i made a halo map identical to level 3 of halo 1

it was kinda like a team based thing where everyone had to work together and use their abilities to survive, it was pretty neat

and then my all time favorite map, Tadpole Wars, it was a mix between golems and penguin wars, but larger and more strategies going on and more possibilites, i made it from scratch and damn it took a long time to make. i had all the triggers done but i only got the "Mega Frogs" half finished... annd then i quit starcraft for whatever reason and uninstalled and lost all of my maps, i had about 20 balanced melee maps and like 5 good but unifinished trigger maps =(

if anyone happens to have any of these maps please send them to me cause i would love to finish them >_<

[JBL]

anyways, as far as triggers go

i made Kirby Bound for the Kirby- clan
annd, i made a halo map identical to level 3 of halo 1

it was kinda like a team based thing where everyone had to work together and use their abilities to survive, it was pretty neat

and then my all time favorite map, Tadpole Wars, it was a mix between golems and penguin wars, but larger and more strategies going on and more possibilites, i made it from scratch and damn it took a long time to make. i had all the triggers done but i only got the "Mega Frogs" half finished... annd then i quit starcraft for whatever reason and uninstalled and lost all of my maps, i had about 20 balanced melee maps and like 5 good but unifinished trigger maps =(

if anyone happens to have any of these maps please send them to me cause i would love to finish them >_<


ouch.. unfinished and unreleased maps are very hard to find...

try to find ur SC budies at that time.. they might have the maps you are looking for..

[Pix]

Hey JBL! Thanks for your advice about the sound, I'm asking about a bit of my map this time.
What I want to do is have an area where the players must move their units across certain beacons. If they step on the wrong beacons (Yellow ones in this case) then gun turrets pop out of the floor and begin to attack. Unfortunately, I've hit a few problems. Any advice on how to make this work?
~Pix~

[JBL]

Hey JBL! Thanks for your advice about the sound, I'm asking about a bit of my map this time.
What I want to do is have an area where the players must move their units across certain beacons. If they step on the wrong beacons (Yellow ones in this case) then gun turrets pop out of the floor and begin to attack. Unfortunately, I've hit a few problems. Any advice on how to make this work?
~Pix~


I might need a bit more information..

I suppose the area is fully covered with beacons.. 2 colors.. which means 2 players... since you are talking about yellow.. I suppose it's player 8 and lets say the other beacons are player 7 owned.. which means they are white.. anyway this isnt important..

there are 2 ways of doing it.. the "first concept that comes to mind" way and the "look at me.. I'm a mapmaker" way

here's the "first concept that comes to mind"

I would put large locations all over the yellow beacons.. make as few locations as possible so it takes less triggers.. then.. when someone brings a unit on one of these locations.. trigger the turrets (i'll say more about the turrets later)

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

now.. the "look at me, I'm a mapmaker" way

Make a small location for every player. location size should be 1x1 for large units like tank or w/e but make it 0.5 x 0.5 (to make smaller locations, use starforge)

now make a trigger that does this:

condition: player bring exactly zero of his "hero" unit to that small location
action: move the location over that unit, preserve trigger, comment, etc.. bla bla

you need one of these for every player

(note: you could even play a .wav in this trigger.. a footstep wav would be great.. so everytime the player moves his unit.. it plays a footstep effect.. this is what makes a map truely sexy)

now that theres this location over ur unit.. you make this trigger:

condition: player 8 brings at least 1 beacon to that location (u need a trigger for every player..)

action: set deaths for academy (or w/e unit) for player 8 to 1

w/e method you use.. (I strongly suggest the later one.. ) the action should be to set a death counter to 1.. so the turrets are turned on in a separate trigger

now you need a way of turning off the turrets when nobody steps on any of the beacons, it's pretty much the same trigger.. but inverted..

condition player 8 brings exactly 0 beacon to these locations (NOTE: you will only need one of these.. but it must include one condition for every players with a location over its unit.. so it means.. when NOBODY steps on a beacon, it turns the turret off)

action: set death to bla bla bla zero (did you get this)

now.. what does the death counters do??..

condition: death of blabla = 1
action: enable doodad state for the turret unit at location X.. preserve trigger (of course)

condition: death of blabla = 0
action: disable doodad state for the turret unit at location X.. and preserve trigger..

note: you will need ONE location for every turret you have and you'll need to enable the turret at this location.. you need 1 action line per turret.... enabling doodads is the worstly made trigger action ever..

of course there's a way to enable every turrets with only 1 location.. but it would take gg skillz, moving locations, and burrowed zerglings.. and.. more time to trigger. unless you have 100 turrets.. if you do have a ****load of turrets to turn on.. tell me.. I'll describe what I'm talking about right now..

so.. you need a location per turret..(and make sure it's really over the turret.. lol) and you need to enable every turret with an action like this:

enable doodad state for the turret at location X
enable doodad state for the turret at location Y
enable doodad state for the turret at location Z
enable doodad state for the turret at location ...

Any questions?

[PowerkickasS]

hey pix
does each player only have one unit?
do color of beacons continuously change?
does every player play on the same track of beacons?
do you want only the unit that steps on the yellow beacons to get hit?
do the turrets have to be placed on the beacon or could they just be further back behind beacons?
if you could answer those questions im sure JBL could give a more accurate advice.

btw hey JBL what's the purpose of seperating the turret enabling triggers? reduce chance of bugs?

[JBL]

hey pix
does each player only have one unit?
do color of beacons continuously change?
does every player play on the same track of beacons?
do you want only the unit that steps on the yellow beacons to get hit?
do the turrets have to be placed on the beacon or could they just be further back behind beacons?
if you could answer those questions im sure JBL could give a more accurate advice.

btw hey JBL what's the purpose of seperating the turret enabling triggers? reduce chance of bugs?


Woaa you are bringing many interesting points in your small post.. let me comment these!

does each player only have one unit?

I do think so.. but.. of course.. the method I stated wouldn't work if the players have 1 or more unit.. that's why I ask map makers to answer the questions in my first post.. and pix already did.. and as I remember.. it's an infiltration like map.. it's close enough to a RPG

do color of beacons continuously change?

If it does.. the first method I stated (the one with big locations) wouldn't work at all and you would NEED to use the 2nd method I stated.. but anyway.. I don't think they change.

does every player play on the same track of beacons?

This isn't very important.. but I think it's a teamwork map.. so.. I'm pretty sure they are on the track.

do you want only the unit that steps on the yellow beacons to get hit?

I don't think so.. but if it's so.. you will need an alliance system instead of the enable doodad state system.

do the turrets have to be placed on the beacon or could they just be further back behind beacons?

Again, I'm not too sure but I don't think the turrets are placed on the beacons. anyway it wouldn't change anything to the triggers..

if you could answer those questions im sure JBL could give a more accurate advice.

Yes, the alliance one and the changing color beacon one. would modify the triggers a lot.. I would like to have more info on these points.

btw hey JBL what's the purpose of seperating the turret enabling triggers? reduce chance of bugs?

[b]Yeah.. it does reduce the chances of bugs.. it's easy to end up with bugs while playing with enable/disable states.. these actions should always be used separately when toogled on actual doodads (its ok if you just disable the beacon to make it look invisible).. but the main reason is.. if later he wants to toogle the turrets with another trigger.. it's much easier.. you gotta think of these details when you make maps...

[PowerkickasS]

ummm....thanks for the last bit

are you bored?

[Pix]

does each player only have one unit?
yeah it's one unit per player.
do color of beacons continuously change?
no, they are constant.
does every player play on the same track of beacons?
yup, they do.
do you want only the unit that steps on the yellow beacons to get hit?
no, if one unit steps on the beacons all players get attacked if they are on the beacon paths or nearby
do the turrets have to be placed on the beacon or could they just be further back behind beacons?
they can be further back
if you could answer those questions im sure JBL could give a more accurate advice.

JBL, I had a look at your advice and while I think it's all great and sound, I'm a little lost. Could you go through the first method step by step for me? Oh, and the players are Blue Zerg, Orange Zerg and Brown Zerg. The beacons are owned by White Terran (The safe beacons) and Yellow Terran (The dangerous beacons which activate the defences).

Thanks,
~Pix~

[JBL]

does each player only have one unit?
yeah it's one unit per player.
do color of beacons continuously change?
no, they are constant.
does every player play on the same track of beacons?
yup, they do.
do you want only the unit that steps on the yellow beacons to get hit?
no, if one unit steps on the beacons all players get attacked if they are on the beacon paths or nearby
do the turrets have to be placed on the beacon or could they just be further back behind beacons?
they can be further back
if you could answer those questions im sure JBL could give a more accurate advice.

JBL, I had a look at your advice and while I think it's all great and sound, I'm a little lost. Could you go through the first method step by step for me? Oh, and the players are Blue Zerg, Orange Zerg and Brown Zerg. The beacons are owned by White Terran (The safe beacons) and Yellow Terran (The dangerous beacons which activate the defences).

Thanks,
~Pix~


I won't explain the first method because it sucks.. and you don't wanna do it..

you really the 2nd method.. I'll try to add more details into the triggers..

here we go.. 1st Trigger. (To move a location over your hero unit)

Players:
Human Players

Condition:
Current player brings exactly zero "name of the hero unit" to location X1

Actions:
Comment
Preserver Trigger
Move Location X1 over "name of the hero unit" owned by Current Player at Anywhere

Notes:
You will need one of these triggers for every human players in the map.
You will need one different location for every human players in the map. (you could name them something like X1, X2, X3, ...)
The location should be 0.5 square x 0.5 square, you starforge to make these.. here's what you should do:
Open the map with starforge.
Make your 3 locations, name them and make them 0.5 x 0.5 (use the snap to grid) you can place them anywhere, top left is perfect.
Save the map.
You could add more actions in this trigger.. if you want a "footstep" sound.. add it there.. play the .wav everytime the location is moved over your unit.

2nd Trigger (switch to turn the turrets "ON")

Players:
Player 8 (Yellow Computer)

Condition:
Current player brings at least 1 terran beacon to location X1

Actions:
Comment
Preserver Trigger
Set Deaths for Academy for Current Player to ONE

Notes:
You need 3 triggers like this, one for every human player.. so the three locations (X1, X2, X3) can trigger the turrets.
You can use ANY unused unit instead of the Academy if it's used.


3rd Trigger (switch to turn the turrets "OFF")

Players:
Player 8 (Yellow Computer)

Condition:
Current player brings exactly 0 terran beacon to location X1
Current player brings exactly 0 terran beacon to location X2
Current player brings exactly 0 terran beacon to location X3

Actions:
Comment
Preserver Trigger
Set Deaths for Academy for Current Player to ZERO

Notes:
The three conditions make sure no one is stepping on a yellow beacon.
You can use ANY unused unit instead of the Academy if it's used, but make sure it's the same unit as used in the 2nd Trigger.


4th Trigger (time to use the death counter as a condition to turn the turrets "ON")

Players:
Player 8 (Yellow Computer)

Condition:
Current player has suffered the death of at least 1 Academy

Actions:
Comment
Preserver Trigger
Enable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y1" for Current Player
Enable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y2" for Current Player
Enable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y3" for Current Player
Enable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y4" for Current Player
etc..

Notes:
This is how you are turning the missiles turret "ON".
You will need one location for every turrets used.


5th Trigger (turning the turrets "OFF")

Players:
Player 8 (Yellow Computer)

Condition:
Current player has suffered the death of exactly 0 Academy

Actions:
Comment
Preserver Trigger
Disable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y1" for Current Player
Disable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y2" for Current Player
Disable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y3" for Current Player
Disable Doodad State for "Turret" at "Location Y4" for Current Player
etc..

Notes:
This is how you are turning the missiles turret "ON".
You will need one location for every missiles turrets used.


That's all.. but you should include hyper triggers in your map.. refer to my hyper trigger post..

and.. that way.. whenever you want to activate your turrets you just have to set the deaths of academies for P8 to one.

I think it should be easier to do now..

[CarriersMustReturn]

How do AIs work?
*feels stupid*

[PowerkickasS]

you use that "run ai script at location" trigger

[JBL]

you use that "run ai script at location" trigger


yup.. but there's the ai script that has no locations needed to run..

you just put the action in w/e trigger... you probably want a trigger with always as a condition..

for the "run ai script at location" if you use it for a melee style thing.. like you want your computer player to act like it was a melee or w/e.. you want a large location.. so the computer isn't stuck in a small area..

there are also many uses for ai script.. you can order units to enter a transport or bunker via triggers.. then.. you want the units and the ship/bunker to be in the same location.. and you probably want 1 location for each bunker/ship...

if the ship moves.. its probably better to move the location over the ship all the time..

here is something very funny..

cond: always
action: move location X over dropship, run ai script "enter transport" at location X, preserve trigger

now make the dropship move over some units.. and they will all enter the dropship..

now what you can do is.. use location Y and move it over the dropship all the time.. and in the location properties you make it air only... so when the unit enters the dropship.. they will be in location Y but if they are on ground.. they wont.. and then you can do something like.. move all marines at location Y to location Z (this location should be hidden somewhere on the map)

so you have a dropship that gets every marines that goes under it.. no matter how many there are.. they will all enter..

but to unload.. you'll need a trigger to move the units from location Z to somewhere else... then to add to the realism you can make the units at location Z appear 1 by one.. and you can add the unload sound..

funny isnt it??

[PowerkickasS]

one of my friends made a lightning sfx......
it was just a testmap, but basically wat happened was:
in the blackness of unrevealed map, with bits of fog of war here and there (dunno how it was arranged, infact not too sure if it even had fog of war tbh i forgot), parts of the map just suddenly lit up in white flashes....and it kept happening randomly.....like lightning.....i was like HOLY W T H
i dont think i have his map anymore....do you know how to make it!?

[JBL]

one of my friends made a lightning sfx......
it was just a testmap, but basically wat happened was:
in the blackness of unrevealed map, with bits of fog of war here and there (dunno how it was arranged, infact not too sure if it even had fog of war tbh i forgot), parts of the map just suddenly lit up in white flashes....and it kept happening randomly.....like lightning.....i was like HOLY W T H
i dont think i have his map anymore....do you know how to make it!?


wow this is interesting.. i've never seen this before.. but.. OF COURSE I DO KNOW HOW!! hehe :)

first of all.. to deal with fog of war vs 100% black stuff.. it's very simple.. it's just like terrain.. except... ur palette will spread some fog of war.. but this isnt even needed..

i'm almost sure it was fog of war.. because after seeing an area.. you can go back to pure 100% black stuff..

so there are 2 ways i thought of doing it.. one of them is soo cheezy i won't waste much time on it.. ill start with it..

lol you'll laugh it's so cheezy.. you need 2 areas.. exactly the same.. and you center view over these really fast.. in one of them you can see.. in the other one.. it's fog of war..

ok forget this.. it's so lol.. now the real way of doing it..

it's all about vision.. if there are buildings owned by a comp plyaer.. u just share vision with that comp..

if theres no building at all.. you'll want a burrowed unit under some doodad.. so you can't see it.. (im thinking of a forest right now.. you can easily hide some burrowed lings or just spider mines..

so.. you need a computer just to do the lightning effects.. it could be used to do something else too (duhh) (btw this is great for intro in rpg.. or for movies)

you want a trigger like this:

turn on vision
wait a bit
turn off vision..
wait a bit
turn on vision...

u get it?? the way i would do it is using death counters and switches.. i would make 2 very simple triggers... using a switch.. if the switch is on.. the vision is on.. if the switch is off the vision is off.. and now you just toggle this switch... kinda fast.. like.. off (wait for a while) on (wait like 10 milliseconds) off again.

the death counter would take care of the "wait" timer

or if this computer is only used for the lightning effect.. you can use waits.. but make sure theres no other triggers for the computer player.. because the wait action stops the WHOLE trigger set for this player..

using waits.. it would look like this.. (the switch is off by default)

wait x (this should be a while because you don't want non-stop lightning effect)
toggle switch 1
wait 10 (by testing you will find how long you need for the optimal effect)
toggle switch 1
wait 7
toggle switch 1
wait 12
toggle switch 1

this would make the screen flash twice.. i think 3 times would look better.. it's only a matter of testing to see what looks the best..

now about the way to use this..
it would be better if it's triggered with a thunder sound...
and it should be used while the view is centered over the area... constantly centered over the same location... this location could also be centered over an unit.. like an observer (owned by ANOTHER comp so u never see it) and you make the ob move to create a "cinematic" effect.. this would be great to introduce something..

hmm i'm not sure if that was clear enough.. if you want more info.. ask me

[PowerkickasS]

lol you'll laugh it's so cheezy.. you need 2 areas.. exactly the same.. and you center view over these really fast.. in one of them you can see.. in the other one.. it's fog of war..

ROFLMFAO

but i thought i actually saw white explosions as flashes (as in there was a buildup and climax of brightness) O_O im gonna go look for the map actually it's gotta be there somewhere.....i hope it's unprotected ehehe

[JBL]

lol you'll laugh it's so cheezy.. you need 2 areas.. exactly the same.. and you center view over these really fast.. in one of them you can see.. in the other one.. it's fog of war..

ROFLMFAO

but i thought i actually saw white explosions as flashes (as in there was a buildup and climax of brightness) O_O im gonna go look for the map actually it's gotta be there somewhere.....i hope it's unprotected ehehe


explosions = a unit is created and then killed.. just like that you can see in bounds.. this is very ez..

[PowerkickasS]

except i dont remember any units that explode like that....

[JBL]

except i dont remember any units that explode like that....


maybe it was some sprites..

[Lord David]

Ok here's mine. I intend on using the custom score for a 1 kill for each time you kill a unit. I got the score board up and running. But here's the problem:

This is the trigger

CONDITIONS:
Current Player kills at least 1 [men].

ACTIONS:
Preserve trigger.
Modify score for Current Player: Add 1 custom.

Alright, the trigger works when you kill your first unit, but it continually increments itself! Ugggh! I put the add 1 custom after the preserve trigger, but that doesn't seem to make a difference. Anyhow, any help would be appreciated, if possible, try it out yourself and see....

Could it be an editor related problem? (I'm using Scmdraft 2.0) :)

[josh]

hey JBL. do you do starforge?

[josh]

as i said in your previous topic, your ACTION is preserved. so once you've met the conditions of the trigger, it will just continue to do the ACTION due to the "preserve trigger."

[Lord David]

But surely putting the add 1 custom after the preserve trigger prevents this. :-\

[josh]

JBL has already answered your question at your previous topic. i don't really wanna steal his job so check it out. :D

[JBL]

Ok here's mine. I intend on using the custom score for a 1 kill for each time you kill a unit. I got the score board up and running. But here's the problem:

This is the trigger

CONDITIONS:
Current Player kills at least 1 [men].

ACTIONS:
Preserve trigger.
Modify score for Current Player: Add 1 custom.

Alright, the trigger works when you kill your first unit, but it continually increments itself! Ugggh! I put the add 1 custom after the preserve trigger, but that doesn't seem to make a difference. Anyhow, any help would be appreciated, if possible, try it out yourself and see....

Could it be an editor related problem? (I'm using Scmdraft 2.0) :)


please read my post and answer the questions.. its going to help me a lot..

thanks.



hey JBL. do you do starforge?


starforge is my *****, it doesn't even crash when i use it.. I know all the way to make it crash so i can avoid them ;)

[josh]

lol. so you know how not to make it crash? starforge is a bit stupid coz it uses cells instead of the ones in staredit.

[JBL]

lol. so you know how not to make it crash? starforge is a bit stupid coz it uses cells instead of the ones in staredit.


cells what do you mean?

well I don't know how to not make it crash but it never crashes when i use it because i know pretty much what makes it crash and i don't use it..

when you use starforge you gotta pay attention to what you do because often, if you do 2 things at the same time.. its the kind of stuff that makes it crash..

good thing it saves backup.. hehe

starforge is by far the best map editor with SCMD2..

I used both..

heres how i was doing my triggers: start in SF make all the unique stuff, load SCMD2 trigger editor, copy paste the triggers into a .txt file.. dupe the triggers that gotta be duped and replace the stuff like.. player #, location names, etc.. then copy paste that crap back in SCMD2, save the map, load in SF...

magic.

In 1 hour I was able to do stuff that people needed at least 10 hours to do.

[josh]

what i mean by cell is when change your terrain its quite like squares. oh yes. a grid in form.

[JBL]

what i mean by cell is when change your terrain its quite like squares. oh yes. a grid in form.


i see

yeah SF do blow for isometric terrain.. never use it for isometric.. but squares are very versatile too..

extended terrains are made with square tiles btw.

[josh]

oh ok. i never did try extending the terrain. lol. and thanks for the tips. :powerup: for ya...

[JBL]

oh ok. i never did try extending the terrain. lol. and thanks for the tips. :powerup: for ya...


thanks a lot sir..

btw.. by extended terrain i refering to those f***ed up and very sexy terrains you can see in weird rpgs.. you know.. the waterfalls and beach and stuff like that made with f***ed effects.. thats all made 1 square by 1 square...

i know it's an insane waste of time when you can do all that in wc3 with about 2-3 mouse click hehe..

[josh]

lol. okay i got you. that explains it. btw, where can i download SCMD2?

[zeratul11]

wow. this is nice. i have not yet read all the details and post on this thread. but i want to learn more about map making in starcraft. so im going to check back on this later. :powerup: to you jbl.

[Lord David]

Yes, I fixed my conundrum, using leaderboard kills.

As for custom score, I simply used the conventional (though tedious) method of 1 unit after another, then giving x amount of points.

[JBL]

Yes, I fixed my conundrum, using leaderboard kills.

As for custom score, I simply used the conventional (though tedious) method of 1 unit after another, then giving x amount of points.


ok it's cool.. if you need any more help.. tell me I'll do my best.


wow. this is nice. i have not yet read all the details and post on this thread. but i want to learn more about map making in starcraft. so im going to check back on this later. :powerup: to you jbl.


thanks a lot..

you should start by downloading x-tra editor 2.5 (or 2.6)

it's a great editor to start...


lol. okay i got you. that explains it. btw, where can i download SCMD2?


man.. I would have said www.staredit.net

but it's dead (i really don't know how it died)

and now.. i've being around the map making world for a while..

but i guess you can visit the channel clan uuu on useast and ask there.. they are truely leet..

once you are there.. you'll notice they are all afk and too leet to be active.. so just go to channel clan oo (after checking clan uuu)

and ask there.. they are a bunch of 15years old nerdy map maker.. but they will help you.

[Lord David]

Alright here's a conundrum for ya! How would you go about making a permanently cloaking unit (Dark Templar) non-cloaked for the player to see? (I.E DT is with neutral player 11, you want current player to see) :P

[JBL]

Alright here's a conundrum for ya! How would you go about making a permanently cloaking unit (Dark Templar) non-cloaked for the player to see? (I.E DT is with neutral player 11, you want current player to see) :P


impossible un uncloak a dark templar..

however you might try to "disable doodad state" it with a location over it and a trigger. but I'm pretty sure this will make the game crash.. I never really tried it.

just make sure the human players have detector OR have shared vision with the neutral player who owns the DT

[JBL]

Thanks for moving my thread here, where it belongs.

[GrahamTastic]

Hey! I have been trying to make a money map :o (*gasp*) for some time now, but I can not figure out how to place the starting points right next to the minerals. How do you do this? I am not very skillful with the StarEdit program. I have spent a lot of time with the WarCraft III World Editor though. Thank you :good:

[JBL]

Hey! I have been trying to make a money map :o (*gasp*) for some time now, but I can not figure out how to place the starting points right next to the minerals. How do you do this? I am not very skillful with the StarEdit program. I have spent a lot of time with the WarCraft III World Editor though. Thank you :good:


This is very simple, you need a new starcraft map editor.

Pretty much every map editor that is not the one included with starcraft itself will work

here's a list to some nice 3rd party editors:

http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=1256.0

Of course, thanks to Imagine. for publishing this list on our forums.

[GrahamTastic]

Great! I will try it out now. Thanks. :powerup:

[JBL]

Great! I will try it out now. Thanks. :powerup:


Thanks..

oh and.. I don't know if I stated this before but I would go as far as reinstalling my map making tools and editing the map myself to fix the bugs/glitch/etc if necessary.

[danhillman693]

EDIT: Problem solved, no need to read this.

I need to know something kinda stupid. It's about the visibilty of the map. How in the heck do I make the map to where all players can see the entire map, including enemy units, unexplored area, etc.? I've removed the fog of war on all players, and I am totally stumped as to how I can do this. Help please. :powerup: and 50 minerals will be sent to the person who helps me first.

[EatMeReturns]

ok so i need a location to center on P1's zergling. the condition is: Command(Current Player,AtLeast,1, Zergling); the player is P1, the actions are MoveLocation(P1,Zergling,P1,Anywhere);Comment("MoveLocationZergling");PreserveTrigger(); the location that is being moved is called P1. what am i doing wrong?

[danhillman693]

Are you using the regular campaign editor provided with the StarCraft game, or are you using a third-party map? If the regular, read this:

1) Change the condition to EXACTLY 1 zergling, or else you will be getting many zerglings being commanded to move to the specified location, and instead of using "CURRENT PLAYER" , use PLAYER 1.

2) Create the location you want a center view over by using the "Location" tool found under "Layer".

3) Make sure the action you choose is "CENTER VIEW", and select the location from the list it will provide you.

[JBL]

ok so i need a location to center on P1's zergling. the condition is: Command(Current Player,AtLeast,1, Zergling); the player is P1, the actions are MoveLocation(P1,Zergling,P1,Anywhere);Comment("MoveLocationZergling");PreserveTrigger(); the location that is being moved is called P1. what am i doing wrong?


nothing, this is perfect and it should works..

just to make sure, your trigger is this:

oh btw, gj using starforge, it's simply the best map editing tool (imo)..


player: player 1
condition: player 1 has at least 1 zergling
action: move the location over the zergling.


with what you told me so far, you did nothing wrong.. but whats happening in your map? maybe some other triggers interfer with this one and makes it doing some weird crap...

check that out. and/or tell me more info about your map.

[danhillman693]

I think I have solved the problem, unless for some reason he is using some strange triggers which might interfere with what I said to do. I don't know, we'll have to see what he says.

[EatMeReturns]

Players: P1
Conditions: Bring(P7, AtLeast, 1, Scourge, P1);
Actions:
KillUnitAt(All, Scourge, P1, P7);
KillUnit(Men, P1);
MoveLocation(P1, Zergling, P7, Ling);
KillUnitAt(1, Missile Turret, Anywhere, P1);
DisplayText("Ouch!", 0);
Comment("P1LoseLife");
PreserveTrigger();


anything wrong with that? cos its either this trigger or the location center trigger.

[danhillman693]

Are all of those triggers working except for the ones you specified in the earlier post? If not, either they are too slow, and that problem can be fixed using hyper triggers, or you have different triggers which may be interfering with other players' triggers.

[EatMeReturns]

i have hypers alrdy, these 2 triggers are the only ones not working. no other trigger interacts with them. i do have a trigger with a wait in it, but its not in hypertrigger comp's trigger list. i heard that waits anywhere can screw up a map though.

[JBL]

EatMeReturns: I need more informations about what you are trying to do..

Players: P1
Conditions: Bring(P7, AtLeast, 1, Scourge, P1);
Actions:
KillUnitAt(All, Scourge, P1, P7);
KillUnit(Men, P1);
MoveLocation(P1, Zergling, P7, Ling);
KillUnitAt(1, Missile Turret, Anywhere, P1);
DisplayText("Ouch!", 0);
Comment("P1LoseLife");
PreserveTrigger();

so far I understand that when p7 sends a scourge to the P1 location, which is centered over your zergling, it kills all your units at P1, (thats probably only the zergling, btw I would change that "killunit(men, p1);" to kill exactly 1 ling for current player at anywhere (I suppose the player 1 has only 1 zergling at the time right???)

now that move location action.. i'm not sure I understand (you gotta understand that I didn't open starforge for like 2 years)

so you move the location P1 over the zergling owned by player 7 at location "ling"? is that right? ok so what is that location "ling" for? is it some kind of stash for the zerglings?

Why do you kill a missile turret?

beside that everything looks perfect, also, if you could tell me what the map is about and what is not working in it, I could tell you what triggers you need.

and to danhillman693: I don't understand your last few posts.. were you trying to help EatMeReturns?

I don't think he wants to centerview, and based on how he describes his triggers to me, he uses Starforge.

[danhillman693]

Oh, I thought he meant he wanted the camera view over a certain location.

[EatMeReturns]

i kill a missile turret becaues missile turrets are the lives. i move it over the white ling so that more scourge do not move in to the P1 location and cause more lives to be lost. P1 has only 1 ling at the time. for some reason none of these actions are performed when a scourge is over the zergling. i will try your previous suggestions for the first trigger.

[EatMeReturns]

I placed a large location around the general area of the zergling-about the view size in gameplay-and called it arena. i then had the location P1 center on Zergling owned by P1 at Arena. I had a test scourge move toward the location P1, and it moved to the center of the location Arena, then died and the second trigger worked. something is whack with my location centering on the zergling trigger... for some reason, it centered on Arena rather than the zergling.

[ninerman13]

JBL - a question about the 'Value This Area Higher' AI script. If you have a computer running a Difficult AI script, and give it a Value This Area Higher at your base, will it go nuts to try and kill you? My problem is further detailed in my thread "Raynor's Revenge," but essentially my map is too hard to beat, and I was wondering if this could contribute to the problem.

[ImaGiNe.]

I am going to interject and tell you this ninerman13: The way the "Value This Area Higher" AI Script works is that it will set a region as “top priority”. After this location has been labeled, the computer will constantly send forces to this region to defend it.

How big is the location where the AI script is supposed to run? What is the difficult AI script you are using?

[ninerman13]

The location encompasses an area about the size of two Command Centers in the player's base. The AI script is a default Brood War one, Expansion Zerg Campaign Difficult. I have Value This Area Highers at each of the player's bases, because I wanted the computer to attack extra hard. It works, but I was thinking that it worked a little too well.

The problem that I was trying to get around, however, is that when the computers are set as Difficult AI and no Value This Area Higher, they tend to attack only one of the player's three bases. I did this also so the computer would attack all of the player's bases. But, at the same time, the computer's attacks become way too intense.

[JBL]

i kill a missile turret becaues missile turrets are the lives. i move it over the white ling so that more scourge do not move in to the P1 location and cause more lives to be lost. P1 has only 1 ling at the time. for some reason none of these actions are performed when a scourge is over the zergling. i will try your previous suggestions for the first trigger.


May I suggest you to remove that "move over P7's ling" action and replace it by "Disable Switch" and add a switch condition in the scourge trigger.. What do you think? this is all about how clean your map is.. most of the time, the cleaner, the less bugs.

also, only for the fashion, I wouldn't use turrets, they are kinda ugly.. have you think of a life bar that you can see on the minimap? something really huge somewhere close to the edge of the map.. with some nice square terrain to make a "life guauge" I'm sure this could be very sexy.

Now I really can't help you without knowing more.. I'm pretty sure your trigger is ok but some other triggers in your map are canceling it.. I suggest you check EVERY single trigger and you might find what's wrong.

[JBL]

I placed a large location around the general area of the zergling-about the view size in gameplay-and called it arena. i then had the location P1 center on Zergling owned by P1 at Arena.


Why do you need this location? couldn't you just center view on the P1 location?

[EatMeReturns]

center view? what? im not trying to center view :P in the trigger for move location, it asks for:
the location being moved, centering on what unit, owner of the unit, and THE LOCATION OF THE UNIT. i put in arena to fill in this last variable BESIDES "anywhere" to see if it would help. it got it closer, but didn't help.

[EatMeReturns]

fixed it, felt like an idiot, had some other triggers messing with the units creation that i forgot to change the condition to never.

[JBL]

fixed it, felt like an idiot, had some other triggers messing with the units creation that i forgot to change the condition to never.


That's what I though hehe.. most of the time the trigger itself isn't the problem.. the bugs are caused by other triggers running before it and screwing it..

but why do you need an arena location if the player only has 1 zergling..

In the post you first mentioned the arena location, in my head it was a moving location over the zergling that was about the size of a screen.

[EatMeReturns]

not moving over the zergling, it IS the actual arena. my map is for the MOTM award :D i added that location and a few others just for personal reasons, they actually more or less do not affect the gameplay.

[EatMeReturns]

i have another question. how do you make the briefings look like something is moving? say i want the letter m to move accross the briefings. would i say,
TextMessage("M",100); then
TextMessage(" M,"100); and just keep adding spaces?

[danhillman693]

I guess so, that would take you awhile depending on how many FPS you are planning to use, (I suggest twenty-four); I'm the briefing master of this forum, for usually every map I make I put music, or in a couple of maps, I use my own voice.

[JBL]

[/qu
i have another question. how do you make the briefings look like something is moving? say i want the letter m to move accross the briefings. would i say,
TextMessage("M",100); then
TextMessage(" M,"100); and just keep adding spaces?


Bingo, however, I don't suggest 24.. I know it looks smooth and all but it will be too fast for starcraft briefing.

oh you need a wait between every textmessage actions try small waits under 100 for animations..

It takes a long time to make good ones.. just practice..

Don't make something too complex, it doesn't add anything to how fun the map is.. you know.

[EatMeReturns]

whenever i run it, it displays an error at line etc. memory x0000000008 or something like that. why? (im talking about the briefing-i haven't done the waits yet)

[JBL]

whenever i run it, it displays an error at line etc. memory x0000000008 or something like that. why? (im talking about the briefing-i haven't done the waits yet)


your map crash?

1st possibility: you placed an unit that make sc crash
2nd possibility: you corrupted you map file with starforge.

try to check for some weird units that could possibly crash sc.
if not, game over, your map file is corrupted.

[EatMeReturns]

its the briefing that makes it crash.

Edit: Fixed, i had portaits that didn't exist in it.

[EatMeReturns]

one last question: how do i get my display texts to work? i have tried alwaysdisplay as 0, 1, and 4, but it never works! why?

[JBL]

one last question: how do i get my display texts to work? i have tried alwaysdisplay as 0, 1, and 4, but it never works! why?


Display text "in game"?

the "always display" code is number "4"

but I suggest you open your map with something like xtra editor and make a single display text action..

then, in starforge, copy paste it.

and yes, unused unit portraits make the map crash at the briefing.. I remember trying to put like.. the portrait of an usused computer, thinking it would be cool.. haha lol

[EatMeReturns]

by the way, what does "always display" do?

[JBL]

by the way, what does "always display" do?


In starcraft, you have the option to disable the text displayed in game, this was meant to be used in campaigns.. but if you text is on "always display" it will be displayed even if someone has disabled the text.

[EatMeReturns]

do you know what could be causing text not to be seen, other than always display not being 4?

[JBL]

do you know what could be causing text not to be seen, other than always display not being 4?


it could be caused by the text itself.. did you use a lot of spaces or something?

if the text is large, try changing it..

is it only 1 text action that doesn't work or is it all of them?

[EatMeReturns]

it is all of them not working. one is simply "(redcolorchanger)Ouch!" but it still doesnt work either.

[JBL]

it is all of them not working. one is simply "(redcolorchanger)Ouch!" but it still doesnt work either.


kk, just do what I first told you to and it should be fine.

[EatMeReturns]

I saved it as a different name then opened this differently named map in the normal editor. i did this to prevent it from deleting improperly placed units on my actual one. then i went to the trigger editor and i changed one of the triggers that was not on always display to always display. i opened this differently changed map in starforge, and checked the new trigger. strangely enough, instead of 4, it had 5 as the always display code.

[JBL]

I saved it as a different name then opened this differently named map in the normal editor. i did this to prevent it from deleting improperly placed units on my actual one. then i went to the trigger editor and i changed one of the triggers that was not on always display to always display. i opened this differently changed map in starforge, and checked the new trigger. strangely enough, instead of 4, it had 5 as the always display code.


That's very strange indeed... I always remember having "4" to do "always display"

however, I've not used Starforge since late 05/early 06 so maybe it got changed in a later version of Starforge.. or maybe i was wrong.. it's been almost 2 years...

[EatMeReturns]

nah i remember using 4 most of the time too...

[JBL]

nah i remember using 4 most of the time too...


Yeah, that's what I remember too.. hmm it's weird.. anyway.. the important is that you get your map working. right?

[EatMeReturns]

it totally worked when i used 5 as the alwaysdisplay code. and i have fixed all the bugs i could find.

[JBL]

it totally worked when i used 5 as the alwaysdisplay code. and i have fixed all the bugs i could find.


Great stuff.. that's a map for imagine's map making contest?

I can't wait to see it.

[EatMeReturns]

I couldn't find a tutorial on how to make beacons "flash"-where you can only see the glow in the center of the beacon and where you cannot select it. can you tell me/make a tutorial?

[JBL]

I couldn't find a tutorial on how to make beacons "flash"-where you can only see the glow in the center of the beacon and where you cannot select it. can you tell me/make a tutorial?


Will do, btw it works on many other units.. the beacon is simply CLOAKED!

hmm? power up?

[josh]

hey JBL. how can you make a team have that same particular color always when making campaign maps?

[ImaGiNe.]

I couldn't find a tutorial on how to make beacons "flash"-where you can only see the glow in the center of the beacon and where you cannot select it. can you tell me/make a tutorial?

There is a tutorial posted on these forums on how to cloak beacons, check it out here (http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=2130.0).

[Moogle]

hey JBL. how can you make a team have that same particular color always when making campaign maps?


Only way to make all players or selected few players have same colors is using a outside program, for instead Guedit this is a very old map protecting program that let you change players colors. So you could be player 1, player 2 and have color white which is Player 7. So you need to find a program which allows you to change players colors.

[JBL]

There is a tutorial posted on these forums on how to cloak beacons, check it out here (http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=2130.0).


He actually requested that before I make the tutorial... lol

Moogle: thx for doing my job, I can't be active all the time hehe.

josh: I suggest you start using another map editor.. such as Xtra Editor 2.5, SCMDraft 2 or Starforge.

[Protosscommander]

Anyway i submitted my map its STARCRAFT FINAL BATTLE http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item42 , the only thing i dont know is how the others can put the image view of the entire map ???

[EatMeReturns]

:O scpicturemapper is what i think the program is called. i havent used it, so i dont know how it works, but that is what i was told to use.

[josh]

oh crap. my starforge is uninstalled. anybody got a link on where to download starforge?

[ImaGiNe.]

To make an overhead image view of your map, download SCM to JPEG. I have compiled a list (with some help) of StarCraft Map Editing utilities into a topic, please refer to the topic by clicking here (http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=1256.0).

You can find both the SCM to JPEG and StarForge download links in the topic.

[josh]

there's something wrong with starforge. i can't get it to work. and xtra editor is crap. i can't understand how to get it to extract.

[Protosscommander]

What isyour point there lol what Starforge do you mean lol :) ???

[josh]

the program is lacking important files. so i can't it to run.

[JBL]

Yes, Starforge can be hard to install.. and you need some files that aren't with starforge itself...

I think Heimdal explained all that on the download page on SEN, howver I'm pretty sure this is gone now..


but I also have to reinstall Starforge.. and I probably have the files you need on my external HDD.. pm me with your email.. I'll see if I can send them to you.

[ImaGiNe.]

You might need to download Visual Basic 6.0 Runtime and Common Controls.

[josh]

@JBL

oh. but i did manage to use starforge before it got uninstalled. i downloaded it at staredit network. okay. i'll send you my email via PM. thanks a lot. if this works, i'll give you a powerup. ;D

@ImaGiNe

for what? xtra editor or starforge?

[JBL]

@ImaGiNe

for what? xtra editor or starforge?


Starforge..

these are .dll files that has to be put in some folders.. I haven't installed starforge in years.. I'm not sure.. however I'll tell you all that stuff in the email with the files (lets hope I still have them) later today.

[josh]

okay. i'll be waiting. in the meantime, i guess i'll have to continue my map using staredit.

[ImaGiNe.]

You have brought up an important issue josh and as such, I have made an effort to update the programs listing topic with the required files, reorganized categories, and many other little bits.

[Premonition]

Hi JBL,

I was browsing this thread and noticed your brief discussion of WAIT triggers can cause problems. I've personally run into them recently and I've had to dance around the issue for a good while until I came up with a creative solution. My map now does what I want it to. But what I wanted to ask you was: how come WAIT triggers glitch out? I don't recall it ever being a problem in the past, how come it's so complicated now... why do they interfere with other triggers/actions/whatever?

[JBL]

First, you gotta know that triggers run one after the other:

Trigger 1
Trigger 2
Trigger 3
...

Trigger 1 will be launched before Trigger 2.

Now if Trigger 1 has a wait in it, the Trigger 2 won't launch until Trigger 1's wait is over. A trigger takes a really short time to run (you can notice that when you have like 50 triggers and one of them is "always, add 1 mineral to current player, preserve trigger" Test it.. the more triggers you will have under the Player/Force, the slower the mineral will come.

So when there's a wait in the Trigger 1, it slows everything else under the same Player/Force.

Pretty simple isn't it?

[Premonition]

I understand it up to that point. Upon which thank you for taking your time to explain :)

But was it always like this? I remember making RPG's/Defense/Golems/Whatever maps that never ran into these "wait blocks" before and I don't ever recall having to use death counters or any other alternative method to wait triggers. And I was just an average map maker... ???

[JBL]

Yes I can assure you that it's always been like this.. I don't see why blizzard would want to "add" such an annoying feature to the map making part of their game.

Not all the maps will extremely suffer from it.. mostly the fast maps with a lot of stuff going on.. or experimental maps relying on extremely weird triggers.. (aka the stuff I used to do)

[Ursawarrior]

ei, jbl, could you tell me how to make exp triggers, ya know, kill one zergling +1 exp, kill 1 hydralisk +3 exp and something like that. if you would be so kind to PM it to me, tnx a lot

[josh]

You should ask moogle. He's an rpg master. Or if you like I'll send you his PM to you about those kinds of triggers.

[ImaGiNe.]

@ ursawarrior16,

We have a tutorial regarding unit kill scores as well as a sample trigger set located here (http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=1283.0).

[Ursawarrior]

@ ursawarrior16,

We have a tutorial regarding unit kill scores as well as a sample trigger set located here (http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=1283.0).


cool, thats really helpful, and one more thing..... is seem to have a problem when i try to make my location move to a unit, the problem is, it doesn't work, lets say ill try to "evolve" my hero when reaching a certain level, but when it reaches my condition, it doesn't execute.... what am i doing wrong?

[Moogle]

Since Imagine gave you a link to the custom score list settles that. For evolve of hero pretty simple to do, here the trigger.

CONDITIONS:
- Current player Custom score is at least X.
- Current player commands exactly 1 Unit. (Optional: This would be hero player is, just to check if alive or not)

ACTIONS:
- Center location labeled 'Location X' on Unit owned by Current Player at 'Anywhere'.
- Remove 1 Unit for current player at 'Location X'.
- Create 1 Unit at 'Location X' for current player.

Hope this helps..

[overmind]

is there any way that you can place special buildings on the instalation terrain, or to import a station terrain to place them?

why won't my players stay the colour i set them as? i really need the player to stay as white, but i have play tested twice, the first time was fine and the second all the teams colours changed.

and a (very) stupid question. how do i convert MP3s to WAV?

[ImaGiNe.]

I have solutions to all your problems:

1.) Using an editor other than the StarCraft Campaign Editor allows you to place any type of building in the installation tileset. You could find other advanced editors that are available to you by checking the link; http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/index.php?topic=1256.0.

2.) First you need to open up your map. When that is opened, click on the Scenarios menu button and a drop down list will appear, then you click on Forces or press CTRL + SHIFT + F. This will open up your map forces. Find the force that your "colored" player is in and uncheck Random Start Location. Click OK to apply the changes.

3.) You can convert MP3 files to the WAV file format by using any sound editor that has the ability (I.E. Audacity [ DOWNLOAD (http://audacity.sourceforge.net/) ], Sweep DOWNLOAD (http://www.metadecks.org/software/sweep/), and Garageband.) or you can use specialized programs such as BeeThink's free MP3 WMA To WAV Converter which can be found at their website (http://www.beethink.com/AudioConverter.htm).

Hope these help!