Force Fire

[coalescence]

Remember that you always saw cloaked/burried units a bit by the weird disturbed air moving around?
What if you could force fire on the ground to try to kill it (and this time damage the unit). It wouldn't destroy the advantage of the cloak because it would require ALOT of micro + the luck of noticing a cloaked passive unit.
Also the chance of destroying a moving unit would be minimal. But it would allow alot more chances for people who are skilled in micro or just have a good sense of observation, to make the game more fun.

Plus you are a little bit less vurnerable against units that you can see (only if you observe well enough) but can't hit.

[Zerat]

some time ago while playing BW I used lukers wyth some small air backup in some missions
as we know the atack if a luker is an aoe atack in a form of a line. Several times there wore death sounds if protos units, but there wore none there moments before the sounds. SO I think they did atack the cloaked units.
I don't remeber all of the units but I think some units could atack ground

[paragon]

People would put SCVs next to cloaked ghosts that were trying to nuke and then attack the SCV with their siege tanks. SCV died, ghost died, nuke failed.

[Dxun]

People would put SCVs next to cloaked ghosts that were trying to nuke and then attack the SCV with their siege tanks. SCV died, ghost died, nuke failed.
ive done the same thing with lukers and drones :powerup:

[coalescence]

some time ago while playing BW I used lukers wyth some small air backup in some missions
as we know the atack if a luker is an aoe atack in a form of a line. Several times there wore death sounds if protos units, but there wore none there moments before the sounds. SO I think they did atack the cloaked units.
I don't remeber all of the units but I think some units could atack ground


They really can't without having a detector.

[PowerkickasS]

i prefer no attack ground options eh. it's always nice to allow a high-tech to nearly totally dominate an unprepared player. or if only units with ranged splash attacks can attack ground.

[Ghost]

I recon cloaked units should be able to be attacked while seen as little rifts. I recon they should be able to even be targeted.

[coalescence]

I recon cloaked units should be able to be attacked while seen as little rifts. I recon they should be able to even be targeted.


Agreed, one of the big differences between good players and less good players is how good they're observing the battlefield. Cloaked units will still have a big advantage because they won't be auto attacked (unless theres a detector). Also alot of less skilled players won't even see where a dark templar is between lots of zealots for example.

The only thing that should not be auto attacked are ghosts, because it would totally destroy the whole nucleaur launch tactic.

[Ghost]

Agreed, cuz imagine this:

Your in a Frigate.. A wraith comes towards you and fires a set of Gemini missiles to you, you get hit and retaliate with about 8-10 misilies, the wraith gets owned and cloaks to protect itself while still firiny, you can still SEE the source of fire, what do you do?

a) you fly around in circles and call in to HQ: "OMG IM GTTNG PWNS SND DTECTORZ!"
b) you fire straight at the source of fire.

[coalescence]

Yeah well, real wraiths would be flying around at like mach 5 ;)

But you have a big point.

[Ghost]

Yeah well, real wraiths would be flying around at like mach 5 ;)

But you have a big point.


True and thx =D

[paragon]

Plus you can just modify your sensors to look for a big energy output or something else equally "suspiciously convenient and yet only done in some circumstances" like in star trek... god i hate those shows/movies

Officer: "Oh no a cloaked ship is firing at us!"
Captain: "Ah just adjust the sensors to look for a massive power source somewhere near us and target it"

Officer: "Oh no a cloaked ship is firing at us!"
Captain: "Oh noes abandon ship!"

[coalescence]

And what are your opinions gameplay wise? :P

[paragon]

Attack ground on siege units, that is all.

[mc2]

The Queen's ensnare can ''force out'' a cloaked unit, the green goo shows exactly where the cloaked unit is and the player can see where they are moving. There should be more different types of unit that have a detecter ability so we don't have to limit ourselves to the weak observer or the slow overlord.

[paragon]

Or the awesome science vessel.
Or the awesome observer... cause it's always cloaked... which is awesome. And it's very inexpensive. Sometimes I would just build a bunch and scout places cause they are so awesome.
And overlords aren't too bad when they have the speed upgrade... although they aren't awesome.

Having another detector unit would decrease the usefulness of these. Especially the observer cause thats all it does.

[PowerkickasS]

a) you fly around in circles and call in to HQ: "OMG IM GTTNG PWNS SND DTECTORZ!"

lol thats great

actually ill change my mind and say no to this. there's no point having ground cloaking when attack ground is possible. invisible guy attacks, "your building/unit is under siege", spotboomdead....

[paragon]

Unless they make the cloaked units completely invisible like in WC3.

[PowerkickasS]

if that's the case then sweet i think all units should have attack ground =D
"WHERE IS IT!?"
"JUST FIRE YOU STUPID PRIVATE!"
and obviously friendly-fire should be enabled for dummies who walk their own units into it

[coalescence]

and obviously friendly-fire should be enabled for dummies who walk their own units into it


Then we need a new building; terran military court.

[PowerkickasS]

yup
and the building remains invincible until the case is finished i.e. an army of zergs would overrun your base in the meantime and wait outside its steps lol

[coalescence]

"You have been found guilty to the charge of murder, you will be sentenced to the firing squad... o wait, hold one. Let me repharse that, you will be sentenced to the zergling squad"

[T-man]

I think the best solution to this would be if you had an attack order (or a right click) ready, and clicked exactly on the shimmer spot, it would start firing at that spot, and then if the unit moved, you'd have to go through the process again.
I remember back in the old days when a DT would storm my base, I ran all of my SCVs around after dumping all my firebats out of bunkers, and targeted the SCVs with the bats after I had surrounded the DT.
Cost me huge resources, but felt so good when i killed the bugger.

[shirija]

Invisibility isn't so much there to make sure YOU can't see it as much as it's there to make the game more challenging by having units that can't be killed without having certain conditions met (cloak detect) imo. So just as you need a certain units to counter other units, cloaked units are best left alone as invincible until revealed. Besides, the little graphic glitch is there simply so you know cloaked units are there, and it's given to you because you can't deal with them without the proper tools anyway. If you can attack ground, I doubt blizzard would have allowed the little glitch.

[Remy]

I completely agree with Shirija on this one.

Messing with cloaking is trying to fix something that ain't broken. It's similar to asking for a way to micro out of getting attacked by air without having ANY anti-air around.

Why water it down to the invisibility of WC3 when cloak is a mechanic unique to SC?

Players shouldn't be given an "out" in these situations. If you didn't put in the effort into recon or didn't prepare for the possibility, you deserve to die to the tech rush.

[PowerkickasS]

yeah i already mentioned that on the first page. but just read the rest of the discussion to see how it developed then you'll understand how it got this far :P

EDIT: come to think of it i guess i was abit vague. ya agreed with you and shirija but would be interesting to see what happens if the other option is implemented. even though im kind of against it maybe lol

[paragon]

Players shouldn't be given an "out" in these situations. If you didn't put in the effort into recon or didn't prepare for the possibility, you deserve to die to the tech rush.

I agree. And I loved dark templar rushing people who wouldn't get turrets.

[paragon]

Yes and as always when there is a question between realism and gameplay, always opt for gameplay.