Science Vessels

[10-Neon]

Science Vessels are absolute rape machines. They're really good at increasing the killing power of the units they are supporting. Defensive Matrix will double or triple pretty much any unit's life span, EMP Shockwave is a must against shield-heavy Archons or large groups of Carriers, and Irradiate never fails to scare the crap out of Zerg players(if they aren't scared, they're clearly insane). On several occasions I have successfully killed over 20 units, Mutalisks usually, with one Irradiate, and this is fighting players that should otherwise know better than to clump their units like that.

[mc2]

science vessels definitely are valuable machines...........they are also terran's only unit detector

on the contray, a zerg queen can easily take out a seige tank with spawn broodlings :D

[10-Neon]

I love Spawn Broodlings, I use it to nail High Templar, but it is such an expensive move, it takes a long time for it to pay off unless you're making a lot of Queens.

[mc2]

that is true it cost 150 energy....

sometimes i use the cheat "the gathering" and literally destroyed my terran opponent's entire base just using queens and broodlings.................its heaps fun :D

[orphean]

Science vessels are freaking amazing units, I always try to use them. Defensive matrix ftw ;D

[Fenix]

Science Vessels are my bane. Besides Lockdown I mean.

I'll be pwning with my Dark Templars, then a Vessel floats along.....Ugh.

I respect them though. And orphean's right. Defensive Matrix is freaking awesome.

[Bumbaloe]

I feel so dumb, I never use science vessels' special abilities... Usually I don't even get them. :O

[Singuris]

Science vessels do rape emp kills shields iridiade organic swarms and matrix defense makes you almost indestructible.

[Fenix]

Science Vessels just continue the line of Terran Advantages against Protoss. It's an Archon killer for sure.

[mc2]

^ yes its truly an archon killer...........it also sends high templar virtually useless for a period of time

and blizzard balanced out the EMP with feedback of the dark archon!!!

[vemynal]

Ah the Dark Archon^^

My favorite of all units^^

(especially if u use "the gathering"^^)

[PainKiller]

Ah the Dark Archon^^

My favorite of all units^^

(especially if u use "the gathering"^^)


Haha ;D Mindcontrolling entire armies! funny as hell! :D

[mc2]

plus mindcontrolling a drone or a SCV and build the entire tech tree of those races!!

[ZerglingRUSH]

Science vessels' emp shockwave is too overpowered imo. You can make all spellcasters useless with one move!

[mc2]

yeah, but then the dark archon can kill spell casters in one move!!

[NotDeadYet]

Feedback only uses 50 energy. So a dark archon could zap multiple spellcasters in just a few seconds.

[mc2]

yes i always wondered why my fleet of battlecrusiers just disappeared
the feedback is powerful indeed

[Whatsifsowhatsit]

What does Zerg have like that?

Anyway, call me a noob, but ... EMP shockwave works on shields too? :o And here I thought it was only good on err, whatsitcalled, energy, mana, oh you know what I mean...

[Fenix]

What does Zerg have like that?

Anyway, call me a noob, but ... EMP shockwave works on shields too? :o And here I thought it was only good on err, whatsitcalled, energy, mana, oh you know what I mean...


No Zerg, the Dark Archon only.


And it's called "Psy" lol. Weird, innit? I always end up calling it mana, but that's because I started on WarCraft.

[Whatsifsowhatsit]

No Zerg, the Dark Archon only.


But I mean like the Dark Archon had feedback against spellcasters and the Science Vessel had EMP Shockwave... does Zerg have such a thing too?


And it's called "Psy" lol. Weird, innit? I always end up calling it mana, but that's because I started on WarCraft.


Yea lol... Psy indeed, now I remember. It's harder to think about since it's not really used like that anywhere else, the word I mean.

[Fenix]

No Zerg, the Dark Archon only.


But I mean like the Dark Archon had feedback against spellcasters and the Science Vessel had EMP Shockwave... does Zerg have such a thing too?


They sorta have a backwards version.....The Devour skill restores mana.

[Whatsifsowhatsit]

Oh ya... well I guess that one'll have to do then =)

[10-Neon]

Praetor Fenix: Defiler, not Devourer.


If the Zerg want to kill enemy spellcasters and insist on using a special ability, then Spawn Boodling is the only choice.

[Fenix]

Praetor Fenix: Defiler, not Devourer.



XD we're both right you know.....The Defiler, and Infested Kerrigan, have an ability called Devour. It kills a friendsly unit and adds their HP to your MP.

[hillzagold]

i've only seen it in videos, but you can irradiate the science vessels and then fly them over enemry units to kill them, right?

[PainKiller]

Yeah! Excelant way to kill Drones with ;D

[10-Neon]

Praetor Fenix: Defiler, not Devourer.



XD we're both right you know.....The Defiler, and Infested Kerrigan, have an ability called Devour. It kills a friendsly unit and adds their HP to your MP.


It just occurred to me that the Defiler can devourer, and the Devourer can defile(I'd feel defiled if I were covered in corrosive purple foam). They are awkwardly named units, aren't they?

--

Self-Irradiation is great. Chews up weak ground units more effectively than casting it directly on them.

[Fenix]

Wait, scratch my last couple posts. It's Consume, not Devour. Devour just sounds so much cooler.


And have y'all ever countered a Zerg Rush with Irradiate? It's quite amusing.

[Whatsifsowhatsit]

A rush? Then how can you get a Science Vessel soon enough? Or aren't you talking about Melee maps?

[mc2]

Most of the time I use irritate on burrowed lurkers. They will die before the spell wears out, and if the enemy happens to cluster their burrowed lurkers together, then double jackpot :D

[Fenix]

A rush? Then how can you get a Science Vessel soon enough? Or aren't you talking about Melee maps?


Not an opening rush of course.

But it's fun. You gotta see it sometime in your life.

[Whatsifsowhatsit]

A rush? Then how can you get a Science Vessel soon enough? Or aren't you talking about Melee maps?


Not an opening rush of course.

But it's fun. You gotta see it sometime in your life.


Hehe ah ya of course... well I'll see if I can get my eyes on it sometime =P

[JBL]

Science Vessels are absolute rape machines. They're really good at increasing the killing power of the units they are supporting. Defensive Matrix will double or triple pretty much any unit's life span, EMP Shockwave is a must against shield-heavy Archons or large groups of Carriers, and Irradiate never fails to scare the crap out of Zerg players(if they aren't scared, they're clearly insane). On several occasions I have successfully killed over 20 units, Mutalisks usually, with one Irradiate, and this is fighting players that should otherwise know better than to clump their units like that.


I totally agree.. they rape against both zerg and protoss.. If you watch pro terran player replays.. they almost always get vessels against zergs.. they use the irradiate on themself and detect to totally rape everything burrowed.. its so great

it's instant death for archons.. and very effective against any other protoss..

but I don't find it that good against terran.. it detects ghosts.. wraiths.. hmm you can irradiate.. but its not as effective as against the zergs... basicly they are only good for defense matrix if you play against terran.. I'm not sure I want to waste my time to get vessels just for the matrix... well I guess it depends of the way you play..

Do you get vessels in TvT?

[Remy]

Most of the time I use irritate on burrowed lurkers. They will die before the spell wears out, and if the enemy happens to cluster their burrowed lurkers together, then double jackpot :D


The AoE effect of irradiate does not work on burrowed units. Proper reaction to irradiate on the Zerg player's part is to burrow the infected unit, micro them away from the rest of his troops, or to micro them into enemy bio units.

Zerg really got the shaft as far as caster units go. Other races have three casters plus units with single special abilities, Zerg gets two casters and one of em's rather useless. If only we had Science Vessels, sigh~

[mc2]

^ the good thing with AI zerg players is that they are stupid :D ^

I irritate one lurker, and all of the lurkers in that cluster unburrows!! seriously they are dumb.

[Singuris]

the point of irridate is in the later game to use it on enemey workers because at that point you should have your opponent very occupied

[10-Neon]

Ok, workers, and not that big juicy cluster of Mutalisks.

[Singuris]

marines should be used vs mutalisks 8 or more to a group with sitm pack and 4 medics that will blow them to pieces.

If AI or human is what you are fighting they'll disengage the mutalisks you target with irritate. making it only kill one unit or how ever many you put it on

[JBL]

You don't irradiate the enemy unit.. u irradiate ur 2nd vessel.. and u irradiate the first vessel with the 2nd one..

so you have 2x moving irradiated balls that follow the lil zerglings everywhere.. bye bye lings..

teamed with some other units.. (like some M&M) it's gg for the zergs

[Remy]

Mutas do not deal less damage to anything. Mutas deal normal damage. Extra range vs muta is almost a non factor cuz just about every ranged unit has longer range than mutas, every Zerg player who make them already know this.

Irradiating workers late game is nothing more than a novelty usage. It's easier to just burrow single workers than it is to pick out the one irradiated muta out of the whole bunched up stack and maneuver it away before the rest suffers too much damage. If you're dealing with more than one irradiates at the same, time then it'll only be more painful for the Zerg player. Where as individually burrowing workers is hella easy cuz they don't stack like air units. They're only 50 minerals anyway, compared to other units, that's hella cheap. And at late game a Zerg can replace workers hella fast even if he does lose a few.

Even if you did eraser instead of irradiating the drones directly, at late game hitting the enemy econ supply has probably the least impact out of all other strats possible. You're betting on a small window of opening where your opponent's production might slow down after a few waves of successful attack. You're better off just trying to eliminate expos altogether. The later you are into a game, the less impact picking off workers have on the opposing player.

I usually don't go this far but... if you think irradiate is for mineral lines at late game only, you're an idiot. I hate ppl arguing a wrong point with wrong facts, especially when it's regarding my favorite air unit in all of SC.

[Singuris]

Mutas do not deal less damage to anything. Mutas deal normal damage. Extra range vs muta is almost a non factor cuz just about every ranged unit has longer range than mutas, every Zerg player who make them already know this.


incorrect there are different types of armor as in prima's stratagey guide (came in boxed set) which has only one useful thing the damage and unit stats tables.

and in my opinion irridiate is not useful at all i'd rather use seige tanks and if the units cloaked or burrowed i'll have quite a few commstats(nukes not really that awesome)

[Remy]

^Here we go again. What you refer to as, and I quote "types of armor," is incorrect, it is unit size.

SC does not have different types of armor. There are small, medium, and large unit size types, and then there are normal, concussive, and explosive attack damage types. No armor types anywhere.

-Normal damage deal 100% full damage to any sized unit and does not have bonus/deduction mods.
-Concussive damage deal 100% to small units, 50% to medium units, and 25% to large units.
-Explosive damage deal 100% to large units, 75% to medium units, and 50% to small units.

That's it, there are no different types of armor. Mutas are small air units that deal normal damage. They deal full damage to EVERYTHING in the game, and receive reduced damage from most things in return. Please do not correct me based on a printed strategy guide, as they are trash. If you somehow still do not understand, or have a hard time grasping these facts, let me know I'll try explaining them to you further.

[Singuris]

^Here we go again. What you refer to as, and I quote "types of armor," is incorrect, it is unit size.

SC does not have different types of armor. There are small, medium, and large unit size types, and then there are normal, concussive, and explosive attack damage types. No armor types anywhere.

-Normal damage deal 100% full damage to any sized unit and does not have bonus/deduction mods.
-Concussive damage deal 100% to small units, 50% to medium units, and 25% to large units.
-Explosive damage deal 100% to large units, 75% to medium units, and 50% to small units.

That's it, there are no different types of armor. Mutas are small air units that deal normal damage. They deal full damage to
EVERYTHING in the game, and receive reduced damage from most things in return. Please do not correct me based on a printed strategy guide, as they are trash. If you somehow still do not understand, or have a hard time grasping these facts, let me know I'll try explaining them to you further.


light=small
medium=medium
large=heavy
(I'm so sorry i didn't use the proper terms but you obviously understood what i meant)

I know that guides are crap as i said before but it's got the same stuff blizzards site has. The only useful part is the following chart:

http://www.battle.net/scc/GS/damage.shtml

Yes i did see the damage chart you were correct but a marines also are small and deal normal and 8 or more marines stim pack and 4 medics I'm sure they would be more effective vs a team of mutalisks than irritate.

Any way back to what I was trying to say irritate isn't that good of an ability and after giving it some though it works well vs guardians (zerg siege tank) forget the workers.

So sorry i questioned your ultimate knowledge of starcraft :P

[Remy]

No Zerg in their right mind would sit there and fight you to the death with your stimpack marines. They can just fly around and keep hitting different spots avoiding you.

If you give chase and the marines are spead thin enough where the mutas won't face a large group, stimpack or not, the mutas can just pick off the marines one at a time.

As long as the Zerg has 5 or more mutas, he can one-shot-kill one marine at a time, then just keep flying away and coming back for another marine. With 8 or more mutas, same thing but this time medics, one by one.

[mc2]

I read over this topic just then and barely anyone mentioned defensive matrix!!
It does work quite well on tanks and BCs.

[Singuris]

Hold ground (except medics) with a squad this small i'd be on the defense defiantly not give chase (and optical flare mabey)

bc i hate those i'd rather have another command center or their worth in marines