Joneagle_X's WWI StarCraft 2 Review

[Joneagle_X]

I hope you guys enjoy my article. A lot of thought and work has gone into it. I tried to represent everything in the game that has any sort of important or has been changed at all. Of course, I will never remember everything so feel free to start asking questions. I'll try to answer everything I can in this thread but please remember that I'm on vacation and have only dial-up internet from my cell phone, so it's very slow. I will answer what I can when I can.

Without further ado, please enjoy my report!

Please source this article if you intend to use it on your own website! Thanks!

Blizzard’s Worldwide Invitational is a chance for players from around the globe to participate in tournaments involving Blizzard titles outside the conventional competitive setting. However, the Invitational is also a chance for Blizzard to showcase their latest titles and allow the public access to these upcoming games. Of course, you should all know about the highlight of the event, the announcement of the next step in the Diablo series, Diablo III. What most of our readers on Starcraft2Forum.org are interested in above all else, however, is the gameplay from Starcraft 2. That’s what I’m here to bring to you, my personal and raw interpretation and review of this game.

After having also played the game in Irvine in March, and having played Starcraft 2 for over 18 hours this weekend, I believe I can claim to have the lengthiest play time with the current builds of Starcraft 2, probably in the world. In summation of my experience I can say that the game is absolutely riveting but there remains a number of problems, including some difficulties in the overall mechanics of the game and the interaction between races.

I’ll take a similar approach to the review as I did in my last report, starting with each race and then finishing with a complete overview of the interaction between the three races and possible solutions to the problems foreseen during the time I had to play the game.

The Protoss

The Protoss are overall very similar to how they were in Irvine. The race has a fixed number of options early game that slowly diversifies as the game progresses. The multitude of new units at mid game for the Protoss really opens up a myriad of strategies. When facing a Zerg opponent, the strategic options are very similar to the original StarCraft. You might choose to go with Colossus and Stalkers mixed with Zealots, or you might choose High Templars. The Colossus are perfect against, well, anything. The High Templars and Psi Storm are still very effective, although Roaches are a bit more ideally suited to surviving and avoiding Psi Storm and take so much more damage than Hydralisks that the High Templar option at this time isn’t as effective as the Colossus. In addition, the Colossus has an upgrade that allows you to extend the damage area of the heat beam, which makes the unit even more dangerous.

Against Terran, the Colossus is also very effective. In fact, the Colossus seems to be pretty overpowered. The only real counter on the ground is the Siege Tank. I tried to use Jackals in a similar role as Vultures in order to keep Stalkers and Colossus at a distance, but that proved very difficult as the Colossus can wipe out an entire group of Jackals by itself. It appears the only Terran counter to the Colossus is either a large amount of focus-firing tanks, or air power. From the viewpoint of the Protoss, the Nullifier and Colossus are two of the best options, in addition to the obvious counter of Immortals. The Immortal can all but make the Siege Tank useless. Mix in Immortals, Colossus, Stalkers, and Zealots, and the Terran player will find it very hard to counter such a force.

Against a Protoss opponent the options are much more limited. It seems to standard fare for a PvP match is most definitely Zealots with the Charge upgrade, and Immortals with Hardened Shield researched. This matchup is still very much dependant on the sheer number of units the player can produce. Much of the same mechanics come into play. A useful hint is that the Warp Gates produce units much, much quicker than the traditional Gateway. The cool down required by each gateway is up to five seconds shorter than the build time of the respective unit. Therefore with a bit of micromanagement a player can churn out a significantly larger amount of Zealots anywhere on the map. This offers a nice counter balance to the MBS argument. Proper use of the Warp-In mechanic and sheer macro seem to be the most important aspects of this matchup, as well as the timely research of the required abilities, Charge and Hardened Shield.

Lastly, the third tier of the Protoss has very much been narrowed. The Carrier has reverted to its original form minus the upgrades. It costs 200 minerals and 400 gas, which is extremely expensive. Right off the bat it can produce eight interceptors, but overall the unit is very, very weak. It's extremely ineffective in relation to its cost. The unit at the moment is worthless. The Mothership has also reverted to something similar to its original form. It's very powerful and very expensive but has lost a few abilities. Now it only employs Time Bomb, Recall,and Energy Distribution. Recall is a recent ability that allows the player to transport their entire army to the Mothership’s location. However, because the Mothership is now extremely slow it is almost beyond use as an offensive unit. In my opinion its recall ability is useful mostly as a “town portal” type ability. If you’re caught late-game with your pants down, this unit is great to bring your forces back to a defensive position.

Overall the Protoss look very polished. They feel very cohesive and have a sufficient amount of strategic options. Some units are simply too strong and other simply too weak, but the Protoss arsenal seems full. I do not foresee any major changes to this race because all the necessary functions are there.

...Continued in next post...

[Joneagle_X]

The Terran

In the original StarCraft the Terran were known as the “glass cannon.” Their units are very powerful but lack any real damage tanks, like the Ultralisk or Archon. In the sequel some changes have occurred to reduce this dependence on range while still maintaining the “glass cannon” status that makes up the race’s identity. These steps include the addition of the Marauder, the Thor, and the new shape of the Supply Depot. The Marauder is an expensive early infantry unit that is very similar in its role to that of the Medic. It lends longevity to the Marine which can now be mass produced from the Barracks because of the reactor addition. The Thor acts like a shock absorber even though it’s role at the moment focuses primarily on air defense. On a side note, I expect the Thor to be thrust more into the “damage tank” role and become more similar to its original role as it currently lacks any real identity. Lastly, the new Supply Depot makes walling in so easy and routine that players can simply wall off and prevent all but the earliest rushes and the lowering ability of the Supply Depot allows offensive movements while also supporting a solid defensive structure that can be manned by as few as two or three Marines.

When facing a Protoss opponent, the traditional units come into play. Tanks and Marines are very effective and an interspersing of Marauders can all but make Zealots obsolete. In fact, without the Charge upgrade, Zealots are all but useless against Marauders. The problem is the Marauder’s cost. They’re very expensive and tough to produce in any significant number. This creates a dilemma in that often Marauders become a target because of their cost. Marines are much, much more expendable than they were in the past because of the rate at which they can be produced from the Reactor. Now Marines can be produced so quickly and in such numbers that a Terran player can simply overwhelm his opponent unless the opponent has some kind of splash damage unit (Banelings, Colossus). Surprisingly, this is actually a viable strategy. It forces your opponent to become defensive and at the very least will gain the Terran player map control, especially with support from a powerful air unit like the Banshee.

The Viking, however, seems to have lost its bite. It's still rather expensive at 125 minerals and 75 gas, and is effective mostly against light units like the Zealot. However, it is still useful against units like the Siege Tank, Colossus, Capital Ships, and light air units. Cost for cost the Viking is very effective against the Mutalisk, but I attribute this mostly to the weakness of Zerg air units. However, I would still say that Terran isn't having any trouble in the air, partly because of the weakness of the Zerg in the air. But at the moment there is no need for a light air fighter like the Predator.

The most obvious issue with Terran at the moment is the Battlecruiser. Frankly, the unit is so unbalanced that it is absolutely unstoppable. When faced with only 10 Battlecruisers against an unskilled opponent (whom I had allowed to live after early game domination simply to explore the higher tiers of Zerg) I was unable to summon enough of a force to stand in their way even from six expansions and almost complete map control. The combined power of a large group of Corruptors and a large group of Hydralisks was so ineffective against these Capital Ships that I killed only three of the ten. In the plainest of terms, the unit needs to be nerfed. Part of the problem is that the Zerg no longer have a high damage air unit similar to the Scourge. The other problem is that the Battlecruiser does not waste damage. It fires a long burst of small lasers that pass on to the next unit after the unit it’s attacking is killed.

The Terran have clearly had a graphical update. Each unit is much more detailed, including logos on each individual Marine and an update in the shape of the Marine’s shields. From what I’ve been told in interviews at WWI each of the other two races can expect a similar revamp. Overall the race is solid but lacks identity for the Thor as well as some real strategic options. The race is currently too dependent upon their ability to produce masses of certain units, which is not congruent with the race’s age-old identity. Expect some of these issues to be resolved in the coming months.

The Zerg

The Zerg have the longest distance to travel as a cohesive race. Their appearance has certainly improved but this race is still at a severe disadvantage in certain matchups. They lack air power and many of their units are too weak and expensive to have any effect on the battlefield. Most of this is caused by the race’s singular identity. It's a tough task to balance the Zerg’s dependence on a mass of units with the cost required to produce these units. Too cheap and the Zerg can just overpower the other races too early. Too expensive and the units become useless, as they are now.

The first problem is the Corruptor. This unit has been weakened severely. It still infests any air unit it kills but the infested unit does not contribute to the tide of the air battle. This completely eliminates the unit’s original role and means that the unit is both expensive and ineffective. It fails to provide enough damage to Capital Ships to even be considered against them. Just two or three Phoenixes can completely eliminate a swarm of these units with just one or two Overloads.

The Mutalisk faces a similar fate. While this, similar to the problem with the Corruptor, is a balance problem that will not doom the unit, it weakens the race’s ability to compete from the mid-tier onward. Also, because of its inability to stack and the resulting spacing issues, as well as the Thor’s new area of effect air attack severely limit the Mutalisk’s impact as a harassing unit.

Another obvious issue is the Queen and the Zerg’s very early game strategies. There are two new defensive buildings for the Zerg that are built using a Drone instead of the Queen as it was previously. The Spine Crawler is the replacement for the Sunken Colony, and is built directly from the Drone and requires the Spawn Pool. This creates a problem in very early game Zerg vs. Zerg matchups because a slight delay in acquiring the Spawn Pool can spell a player’s doom through an easily executed Spine Crawler rush. The defending player, even with only a five second delay in building their Spawn Pool, can be faced with an insurmountable attack in the form of three or four enemy Spine Crawlers built on their own creep. Drones are insufficient to counter the threat and the delay in building your own Spine Crawlers is deadly. The only counter which I didn’t explore was building a Queen early instead of the Spawn Pool. Using this strategy and Drones may be enough to halt any early attack, but it is unclear whether it will be sufficient to stop a focused Zergling attack.

The Queen is still an issue in that she has become more and more of a defensive unit. She is quite quick whenever she is on creep, including enemy creep, but the minute she leaves it she slows to a crawl. She’s absolutely ineffective off of the creep in any way. She’s also very vulnerable to attack throughout the game and is a huge loss because of the amount of time and monetary investment required to maintain her as a unit. Her abilities are worthwhile (like her ability to heal any building or unit 150 HP instantly, or her swarm defense ability which allows her to add defense to any building at her Huge Queen stage). Her attack has been changed to a ranged attack and has been weakened, although at her Huge Queen stage she still has a formidable HP of 600. She still has a way to go as far as balancing her abilities because, for example, her ranged attack all but nullifies the effect of an early Mutalisk rush. Overlords are a much more tantalizing target in the current circumstances because the Queen can singlehandedly fend off up to about five Mutalisks.

Overall the Zerg are making progress. They’re becoming more diversified strategically, such as the change in the Roach’s role and the addition of moving base defenses, as well as the mechanic which allows you to build Creep Tumors directly from the Hatchery without a Drone, and then allows you to build another Creep Tumor from each successive Creep Tumor for only 50 minerals. This combined with the Overlord’s ability to spread Creep has made Creepan effective weapon for the Zerg in halting expansion and as a “boost” in their force’s effectiveness. I think we will see further exploration on the part of Blizzard of this spreading Creep as the primary identifier of the Zerg race.


...Continued in next post...

[Joneagle_X]

Some of the new units that we’re seeing out of the Zerg are also quite exciting. The Swarm Guardian fires spores that deal 40 damage to all ground units, and also spawns broodlings which are absolutely ineffective but are good at drawing the fire of units and are especially useful against Terran Siege Tanks. These little intruders draw the tank’s fire which causes devastating friendly fire effects. Just a few attacks on a mineral line of SCVs will completely destroy the enemy’s economy with their own firepower. However, you no longer need more than two or three of these units unless you aim to go after static defenses.

Another interesting addition is the Mutant Larva which is an ability of the Queen. She can instantly morph any larva into this mutant larva which takes time to build. However, once the larva is built it can be transformed into any Zerg unit almost instantaneously. This is great for producing Mutalisks or other advanced units even earlier and en masse before their tech is even available. You can build ten of these larva and then wait for your spire to complete while saving up resources. As soon as the Spire finishes you can then produce ten Mutalisks almost instantaneously without even a second hatchery. This speeds up the tech of Zerg exponentially and will have enormous benefits for quick tech. It also provides a lot to the macro managing player.

The last issue dealing with the Zerg is the Hydralisk and Lurker. The Hydralisk is at tier 2 but costs 100 minerals and 100 gas. This makes the unit all but impossible to produce en masse. It now deals 13 damage, but at the moment has only 80 HP which makes it unsuitable for combat unless supported heavily by other units. This means that the unit is mostly a means to an end to attain Lurkers. However, the Lurker mutation of the Hydralisk also seems under powered. It deals 10 splash damage in a line similarly to Brood War but deals 13 extra damage to armored units. However, in the face of its added cost it isn’t a very effective unit, especially considering its immobility and its relatively low bonus compared to other units (Marauder gets +20 damage against armor and is tier 1).

Overall

The game is certainly shaping up. The interaction between the races has improved each time I’ve played and there are at least semblances of counters to each strategic option. While there are still a few units that simply over power the competition, most of the issues are easily fixed. In my opinion the Protoss are nearly finished. They’re polished, look great, play well,and are diverse. The terran and Zerg are much further behind, and I actually feel that the Zerg are in a stronger position as far as development because they have a solid race identity at this time, mostly because of their different play style which now relies so strongly on the queen and expansion of Creep. This identity has a clear path of development and should ensure that the Zerg are a challenging and fun race to play in the new game. They certainly offer a much more diverse reaction to the standard Protoss gameplay and open the race to users who previously might not have been capable of handling units like the Lurker and Defiler to their utmost ability.

The Terran have the longest way to go as far as finding their identity. Right now they’re relying on numbers rather than placement or strategic strength to get the job done. In fact, at times it seems that they are capable of outnumbering the Zerg and it is the Zerg who have to then resort to splash attacks to survive the onslaught. This should never occur. The Terran need an interesting twist in their strategic mechanic to keep them viable in StarCraft 2.

Whatever your instinct, and whether or not you’ve played this new game, I would encourage you to continue to follow its development as it nears later stages. I believe the game is progressing in leaps and bounds and I eagerly await the next update which should include some major changes to the Terran race.

[furrer]

Great I have been waiting for this one, but the text is a bit big? Im gonna read now!

[kuvasz]

It's not big, it's a tightly packed seriffed type and they literally murdered my eyes by the time I cut through these posts.

I'm surprised you deem the Zerg to be better than Terran but I can see your point, it being identity. Most of the issues you mentioned are directly related to balancework though, so they don't mean much in terms of which race is closer to being finished.

Thanks for the info, and we mourn your camera.

[Psionicz]

Very well done and sexy report.

I would like to ask whether you think the Colossus would be less overpowered and have more of a micro aspect to it with its old attack?

Marauder or Medic? Or both?

Thor limits the use of the Viking? As to me the Viking seems like a unit which could be used all game, but with the Thor changes, it seems to limit it, to only be used as a harasser or to catch tanks off guard.

[furrer]

You posted the same post twice.

Questions only to JON:
Zerg:
How much did the Roach cost?
The Lurkers + 10 armor makes it weakers against Marines, its counter in sc2, how did that work in?
+ 20 vs armor for the Marauder, are you sure? Other sites say between 5 - 10
The Hydralisk, cant be build in masse so? Did the zerg feel less massing then?
Early air attack vs Zerg: Did the hdyralisks big gas cost hinder you in definding phoenix (or what its called/spelled)) / dt rushes (bisu-build)?

Terran:
Has the Thor found its right place?
Did you miss the medics, and how usefull were the marauders compared to the old medics?
Was the reaper very usefull, compared to the medivac dropship, or did those two just overlap?
So the Terran can fight against Stalker/Immortals if they use Marines + Tanks? Does that mean that this build is usefull: Barracks + reactor with Factory + Tech Lab?
Was the Jackals "fire" usefull against Zerg and Zealots?

Protoss:
The MS was build at the Nexus, so in lategame you can have it everywhere where you have bases, doesnt that make up for its slowness?
The collosus was OP, what should be done with it? Is reducing its damage enought?

Overall:
Was it possible to do more strategies compared to SCBW? Also not just vultures/tanks against Dragoons/Zealots?
How long do you think it will take Blizzard to finish the gameplay (not the missions)?
Were all units usefull (overlaps perhaps a bit with the first question)?
Did you have a good time? :D

Ill add more if I remember more.
PS: Should I make a topic were I wrote all questions and answers down? Or will you?
PSS: I have given him a reputation point for the post, just so that we dont all give him a point, because I think its so the system should work or?

[Joneagle_X]

The Colossus might indeed be more balanced with an attack that simply does not waste damage, but for the cost I think it needs that "mass" destruction aspect that it has. I think the damage rate just needs to be reduced. Just one or two can completely turn the tide of a gigantic battle. It's almost unfair. But that's just a balance issue. :D The Colossus is a great unit and it has a new attack animation. The beam starts at one spot and sweeps either left or right. It's no longer a "fan" of lasers.

The Marauder is entirely sufficient to help keep your Marines alive. The Terran can do completely without a Medic. If she's needed at all it would be in the later tiers when you can get the Medivac Dropship (which I still hate). I just wish the darn Marauder weren't so expensive.

The Thor is a lost soul. I don't know where it fits and neither does Blizzard. The Viking, however, is useful, but is pretty expensive for being relatively weak. It's good to drop in and surprise units and is especially good against tanks, like you said. I prefer the Banshee 100 fold.

[ninerman13]

Excellent, excellent, excellent report!

I am actually not surprised that the Zerg surpassed the Terrans in terms of development, and based on what I've heard/seen I completely agree with you. Once Blizzard figures out how to deal with the Thor (to be honest I'd be in favor of total scrapage for something new and exciting), the Battlecruiser, and mass Marines, we should see a better emergence of their race identity.

Jeez I just get more and more excited about this game every single day. I swear that it's going to be the downfall of me in medical school hahaha.

[furrer]

JON please answer all my questions if you have the time.
And i got 3 more:
- Did the 2 gas make it possible to go for more gas heavy strategies (very fast tech, things like phoneix (or how its spelled) + dt from one base etc.)
- How did it work with the 6 workers 5 minerals per field? Was
- What do you think of the "minerals for gas" abbility in the extractor?

[marcusrodrigues]

Great Report, JonEagleX! I sure hope that Blizzard reads feedbacks like yours to improve the game!

[kuvasz]

[...] The beam starts at one spot and sweeps either left or right. It's no longer a "fan" of lasers. [...]
I just soiled my pants. Focused beam FTW! Did both sides of the head of the colossus emit the beam or was it alternating? How fast was it moving from side to side? Please compare it to a move speed of an SC1 unit. I want to know everything about the unit! :twitcy:

[furrer]

Take it easy kuvasz, you want a cake? :D
Yeah its great the old one is back, the new one was sick, blocked the screen completly.

[Joneagle_X]

I will answer questions I didn't already answer above.

Zerg:
How much did the Roach cost?

75 minerals, 25 gas (Same as past Hydralisk)


The Lurkers + 10 armor makes it weakers against Marines, its counter in sc2, how did that work in?

Lurkers are definitely weaker against Marines. They're better for taking out large groups of Vikings and Jackals or Stalkers, but overall I found them pretty useless relative to their cost. I only tried to use them once and learned my lesson quickly.


+ 20 vs armor for the Marauder, are you sure? Other sites say between 5 - 10

According to my notes the Marauder has +14 damage to Armored units. I said 20 in the article only because I was emphasizing the point.


The Hydralisk, cant be build in masse so? Did the zerg feel less massing then?

No, just certain units. I'm disappointed with the Hydralisk and Lurker, but that's just a cost issue. I think it is easily corrected. The problem is balancing its use while keeping it separate from the Roach.


Early air attack vs Zerg: Did the hydralisks big gas cost hinder you in definding phoenix (or what its called/spelled)) / dt rushes (bisu-build)?

I tended to be more reliant upon the Roach and Mutalisk. The Corruptor is relatively cheap and since it can be built directly from the Lair tech without a Spire it can respond quickly to air threats. It's just not effective against Capital Ships in ANY way. I didn't find the absence of the Hydralisk to be particularly worrisome. It's just difficult when you need a strong ranged unit. I utilized mostly Banelings and Zerglings but it is difficult, I assure you.


Terran:
Was the reaper very usefull, compared to the medivac dropship, or did those two just overlap?

I found the Reaper to be very useful against Light units. They absolutely own Marines pound for pound. They do the same to Zealots. Their mobility is also a huge advantage. Bringing the Medivac Dropship along just slows them down. They're fine on their own. Just run when there's a serious fight. I also liked to leave my mines behind and retreat slowly, thereby causing MASSIVE damage to any serious force pursuing me.


So the Terran can fight against Stalker/Immortals if they use Marines + Tanks? Does that mean that this build is usefull: Barracks + reactor with Factory + Tech Lab?

Yes, but you will take massive losses with your Marines. The trade off is that you can produce so many Marines so quickly that it hardly even matters. I liked to intersperse some Marauders because of their higher hit points.


Was the Jackals "fire" usefull against Zerg and Zealots?

Yes. I said somewhere in the article that beyond those early light units, though, the Jackal becomes useless. Remember how the Vulture was pretty much helpless against Dragoons? It's the same way with the Jackal and Stalker except amplified. The Jackal has only 90 HP and so is very susceptible to all attacks. Just two swipes from a Colossus will destroy an entire group at once. But it's very nice to deal a lot of splash damage to Zealots and Zerglings. It's also very effective against Roaches. I just wouldn't produce them en masse. That's why I don't understand why the Reactor for the Factory produces Jackals instead of Vikings like it used to. Maybe even allow it to produce two tanks?


Protoss:
The MS was built at the Nexus, so in lategame you can have it everywhere where you have bases, doesnt that make up for its slowness?

To a degree, yes. I don't know if you guys are understanding the true SLOWNESS of the Mothership in this build, though. We're talking 10 minutes to cover a medium-sized map. Slower than a floating Command Center from SCBW. Much sloThere are often four or five ways to counter a specific strategy rather than the one you usually have in StarCraft.


How long do you think it will take Blizzard to finish the gameplay (not the missions)?

No one can say. Asking the same question over and over doesn't do anyone any good. I would expect the beta in October.


Were all units usefull (overlaps perhaps a bit with the first question)?
Did you have a good time? :D

Most units were useful. I think some were a little overpriced and a bit too weak like the Hydralisk and Lurker. For their cost there are just better options.

I had a good time but it was pretty difficult to get around and get things done. Also lost my camera :-\.


PS: Should I make a topic were I wrote all questions and answers down? Or will you?


Yes, please do. Name it the "Official Q&A Compilation, WWI 2008"

[Joneagle_X]

- Did the 2 gas make it possible to go for more gas heavy strategies (very fast tech, things like phoneix (or how its spelled) + dt from one base etc.)

The two gases were really there to counterbalance the fact that a lot more buildings require gas. The whole new gas system is really there to give the whole game a little more macromanagement requirements. But yes, you can tech much more quickly but you will also mine less. It's the same trade off as in the original.


- How did it work with the 6 workers 5 minerals per field?

The number of minerals you had was always an increment of five, so it was a little easier to spend. But I don't think it really changed the gameplay at all. I don't think it's better or worse. I think if you had the whole 8 that it used to be the gameplay might be a little TOO fast, but I'm unconvinced. I don't think there's a real reason.


- What do you think of the "minerals for gas" abbility in the extractor?

I think it's annoying, but I do think it brings a little more macromanagement in. If that's what's necessary... I don't think it will be in the final build. They'll find something more interesting. I had heard a similar idea to it from the design team. They said originally that they had an ability which costs 100 minerals that instead of regaining operation of your extractor you would be able to mine with six workers from it for a short period of time.

But the good thing about the way it is now is that your gas never permanently depletes. That means you can continue to use higher tiered units later in the game and the chances of running out of resources altogether is much lower.

[Gasmaskguy]

I noticed in your stat compilaton that most buildings, especially the Terran ones, have a lot less hp. How does that play? I also noticed that the Siege Tank has its old SC1 hp, and 80 damage. You've written that it does "15(80 sieged)(+8 light)" damage? What?... Bonus vs light?

[Joneagle_X]

Nikzad did the Terran stats. Some of them are missing. :-\

But yes, bonus versus Light.

[Gasmaskguy]

Bad Nikzad. I wondered why the Battlecruiser wasn't included at all. xD

Bt you did say you were 100% sure about the Rax, Fact and Star hp, didn't you? So question still stands, since you must have had time to both play and face Terran.

[DE.50]

Does the ability of the Thor to rebuild itself make it a viable tank option, or is it's ground attack so weak that the enemy can just ignore it until all your other units are dead? And do you think that the Battlecruiser needs 2 abilities? Wouldn't it be more sensible to just have Yamamoto Cannon, and leave the air splash to the Thor so there is less overlap.

Edit: One more thing, who do Nydus worms work now?

[i2new@aol.com]

How did the ghost play out if you even used it. How early can you nuke and what abilitys do the ghost have currently?

and the Nomad how was the Nomad if you even used it.

[BirdofPrey]

Sounds to me things are a bit off with very few units actually being useful laving little room for diverging tactics.
Having suh a poor choice of tactivs can make for a boring game

[Kaaraa]

Great stuff Jon! I'm glad to hear how gameplay is working out :D

My Questions:


In SC1 you could scroll over your units upgrades to see their attack. Does doing this in SC2 show the bonus damage certain units do, or did you have to pit units against each other to approximate?

The Colossus might indeed be more balanced with an attack that simply does not waste damage, but for the cost I think it needs that "mass" destruction aspect that it has.
Do you mean it still needs some AoE to it's attack to justify it's cost, or do you just like the sight of sweeping destruction? How do you think it would fair if it still had the old attack, but there was a small range AoE around the beam's target?

What does the 5x2 (x8 Intercept) mean? Each one does 5x2 damage? That seems like a powerful attack to me. Is the Carrier useless because of the lack of focus fire, or the step down in health/shields from SC:BW?

Is the Archon still just a damage sponge, or has it gotten any abilities back? Do you think it needs any (like Maestrom, etc.)?

How does the bonus damage work for units that have multiple attacks, like the Reaper? If I'm reading the table right, he gets +15 vs light units. Is it 15 for each shot, upping it from 3x2 to 18x2, or is it divided amongst each attack, making it 10.5x2? do upgrades to damage work the same way?

Judging from your article it seems the Reactor has pushed Terran towards building some weaker units en masse, which is more of a Zerg thing. Do you think that the Reactor should be nerfed by increasing the time taken to produce units simultaenously? For example, say it takes 40 seconds to produce a Marine. If you produce two at once with the reactor, the time taken increases by 10%, making the 2 marines take 44 seconds to be produced. The numbers could be changed, but I believe such a change could still keep the Reactor usefull without pushing Terran players to delve into Zerg tactics.

The Battlecruiser wasn't in the statsheet. Is the 8x8 attack still there, and is it causing as many problems as you say? How would you propose nerfing it? Would having it waste damage from attack cycles be enough, or would it be more effective to decrease the number of attacks/the damage of each attack?

What was the attack speed of the Corruptor? Do you think an increase in it's attack speed would make it more useful, or just an increase in damage or hp?

Has loss of stacking Mutalisks really had such an impact on their usefulness?

Did having the Crawler buildings built from Drones again feel like a hindrance, or was the extra cost of a Drone to build a good exchange for not having base defense depend solely upon the Queen?

It seems like the Crawlers may be overpowered with their ability to move. Do they still lose HP off the creep? How fast do they move? Do you think the movement speed of Crawlers should be decreased, or should uprooting and moving be a research upgrade to prevent the early game crawler rushes you described?

[lurkers_lurk]

did you think that the Roach filled its role nicely, or do you think it could change?

you didnt talked much about the Ultralisks or the Infestor, how was they like? was there any changes to them?

[Psionicz]

It seems like the Crawlers may be overpowered with their ability to move. Do they still lose HP off the creep? How fast do they move? Do you think the movement speed of Crawlers should be decreased, or should it be a research upgrade to prevent the early game crawler rushes you described?
Off creep they move really slowly and they do lose hitpoints, they move around the speed of an un-upgraded Overlord. Just watch the videos.

[zeratul11]

Did anyone suggest that the thor would be awesome and unique if its gtg exclusive and attack single target only? ^^

ultralisk. splash gtg damage.

coloosus. linear aoe gtg damage.

thor. powerful single target gtg. the gta role is bad for the thor's look.

yes the thor is lost.

i hope they just make the thor the strongest and ultimate terran gtg single target dealer. there are few of this in starcraft like the archon and there is none of this in the terran arsenal.

[Joneagle_X]

Wow. There is a crap load of questions. I'll do my best to answer them all. :D

Does the ability of the Thor to rebuild itself make it a viable tank option, or is it's ground attack so weak that the enemy can just ignore it until all your other units are dead? And do you think that the Battlecruiser needs 2 abilities? Wouldn't it be more sensible to just have Yamamoto Cannon, and leave the air splash to the Thor so there is less overlap.

Edit: One more thing, who do Nydus worms work now?

The Thor is definitely a tank. It also has a great GTA attack. That's why it's so confusing. You can either tank it (though it's pretty ineffective as an actual offensive unit GTG) or you can keep it home as a mobile and extremely effective GTA weapon. It's rebuild looks really dumb ATM but I can see some potential. I still think it should just lift off like a building and then it would be more unique. I even suggested to Samwise (Dustin wasn't around WTF?) that the Command Center have an upgrade to "Thor" and would thus emphasize it's "building" status. Right now it just has NO identity. It's not even built by an SCV.

And the Nydus Worm requires Creep and is a building. You have to be able to see the area you're creating it at. It's exactly like the old Nydus Canal ATM. It's pretty nerfed and dumb. But that is a VERY recent change as all the build devs still thought it was a unit! :D It's still very powerful but nowhere near as cool.

How did the ghost play out if you even used it. How early can you nuke and what abilitys do the ghost have currently? And the Nomad how was the Nomad if you even used it.

The Ghost is a very useful unit, though most definitely it's very tough to use. I simply don't have enough experience with the game (so neither does anyone else) to use it effectively. But it has huge potential. I mostly used it for its EMP ability against Protoss. It's devastating. Nukes are great. They have a bit smaller of a radius and since they're totally ineffective against Immortals it's difficult to use it effectively for its cost. But it's still an awesome weapon. Plus it looks schweet!

As for the Nomad, they switched the model back to the original for WWI but told me that the new one is there but hasn't been perfected yet. I was a little mad about that. It was the first unit I looked for. But no ability changes there.


In SC1 you could scroll over your units upgrades to see their attack. Does doing this in SC2 show the bonus damage certain units do, or did you have to pit units against each other to approximate?

You can still see bonuses and attacks.


Do you mean it still needs some AoE to it's attack to justify it's cost, or do you just like the sight of sweeping destruction? How do you think it would fair if it still had the old attack, but there was a small range AoE around the beam's target?

Still needs AoE to justify it's cost. The old attack with a small AoE might work but it's so cool as is.


What does the 5x2 (x8 Intercept) mean? Each one does 5x2 damage? That seems like a powerful attack to me. Is the Carrier useless because of the lack of focus fire, or the step down in health/shields from SC:BW?

5x2 means two attacks for five damage. So 10 damage total per attack cycle. I'm not sure exactly how this works, but the Carrier is just expensive and lacks any real bite. It's HP has definitely taken a hit. Not to mention Interceptors are also 25 minerals apiece. Expensive. 400 gas? Sheesh.


Is the Archon still just a damage sponge, or has it gotten any abilities back? Do you think it needs any (like Maestrom, etc.)?

Damage sponge. It wasn't as overpowered in this build as it was last time. Before it could almost 3v1 Ultralisks, but now it's back to about 1.5v1.


How does the bonus damage work for units that have multiple attacks, like the Reaper? If I'm reading the table right, he gets +15 vs light units. Is it 15 for each shot, upping it from 3x2 to 18x2, or is it divided amongst each attack, making it 10.5x2? do upgrades to damage work the same way?

Not sure, but I would venture to guess that it divides it up.


Judging from your article it seems the Reactor has pushed Terran towards building some weaker units en masse, which is more of a Zerg thing. Do you think that the Reactor should be nerfed by increasing the time taken to produce units simultaenously? For example, say it takes 40 seconds to produce a Marine. If you produce two at once with the reactor, the time taken increases by 10%, making the 2 marines take 44 seconds to be produced. The numbers could be changed, but I believe such a change could still keep the Reactor usefull without pushing Terran players to delve into Zerg tactics.

The Reactor needs some work. Not sure what needs to happen here. I would say that perhaps there needs to be a mineral cost associated with producing Marines at that speed. Maybe the Reactor just needs to be more expensive and build very quickly. Perhaps 200/200? It's just so easy to get now. Anyone can build 50 Marines in less than 4 minutes of game start.


The Battlecruiser wasn't in the stat sheet. Is the 8x8 attack still there, and is it causing as many problems as you say? How would you propose nerfing it? Would having it waste damage from attack cycles be enough, or would it be more effective to decrease the number of attacks/the damage of each attack?

Unfortunately I didn't do the Terran stats. Nikzad did. I don't know, but it's not on the list he gave. I think the 8x8 attack is still there and it definitely switches to the next target in the middle of a burst. I think it just needs to be more expensive. The unit is great because it can contribute significantly to Terran forces just by itself, but a player should not be capable of massing it like I saw done. For sure, Terran air is the most powerful ATM. By a long shot. Remember that video where a Battlecruiser took on two Carriers with ease? That's about where we stand.


What was the attack speed of the Corruptor? Do you think an increase in it's attack speed would make it more useful, or just an increase in damage or hp?

It was pretty slow. I think it needs a bigger attack. And when it infests units they should start shooting back to help turn the tide. Currently the shooting back feature is gone. I think it should be very similar to the Devourer. Lots of armor, lots of HP, and it's attack should bring Capital Ships to their knees.


Has loss of stacking Mutalisks really had such an impact on their usefulness?

Yes, they're far less mobile. Now they're just an annoyance. Especially with even one Thor hanging around. The dev team has assured me numerous times that they WILL make the Mutalisk stack.


Did having the Crawler buildings built from Drones again feel like a hindrance, or was the extra cost of a Drone to build a good exchange for not having base defense depend solely upon the Queen?

I think it's fine. Not a hindrance at all. The Devs just need to be careful that they don't put too much of a burden on the Zerg to sacrifice Drones while the Protoss and Terran are chugging away. But I do think it's a good idea to move away from the Queen because she allowed for mass defensive structures.


It seems like the Crawlers may be overpowered with their ability to move. Do they still lose HP off the creep? How fast do they move? Do you think the movement speed of Crawlers should be decreased, or should uprooting and moving be a research upgrade to prevent the early game crawler rushes you described?

Don't worry. I didn't have any problem with this. They're pretty slow overall and they lose ALL their armor when they uproot as well as a large chunk of HP. They're so easy to kill when uprooted (and can't attack) that I routinely ignored units to kill them if someone uprooted one (because they're slow to build and cost the player 150 minerals). That's how quickly they died when uprooted. The problem I described had to do with a player's inability to get a head start in building their Spine Crawlers by building a Creep Colony.

did you think that the Roach filled its role nicely, or do you think it could change?

I like the Roach. I just don't like that it has sent the Hydralisk packing. They need to find a way to work the Hydralisk back in to a prominent position. I keep thinking the Roach should be a mutation of the Hydralisk (like the Lurker) or vice versa (Hydralisk from Roach).


you didnt talked much about the Ultralisks or the Infestor, how was they like? was there any changes to them?

Not many changes to them except that the Ultralisk does +40 damage to buildings or something ridiculous like that. Ultralisks absolutely tear through buildings. I was talking with some other site admins about a fully upgraded Ultralisk which would theoretically do something like 115 damage to a structure.

The Infestor apparently has a model change in the works, but no other changes to note other than that.

[furrer]

Ok I will do that topic later today, but Ill only take questions from this topic! Thank you for the answers!

Question:
About the Jackal! What if they made it have a bonus against light (instead of that big bonus against armored), and then no gas cost? Then it would be massable like the marine, and really be like the vulture, also meatshield for your tanks?

[kuvasz]

WTF you took my fecking medal!! >=\
And you didn't even address my post about the colossus.

[AcE_01]

^
now that is slack, kuvask is a really helpful person. Check out the sig he did for me.

back on topic, jon,,,could u please explain the new collosus attack? i didnt quite get that..

[kuvasz]

Relax Ace, I was kidding ;) a WWI coverage is like the best thing this site could get. And Jon's done hell of a lot of work for the site with the tees and admining and Anaheim and everything.

[AcE_01]

^
i totally agree with you, Jon definitely gets that award.....
xD

[BirdofPrey]

WTF you took my fecking medal!! Be glad you got a medal. You're not the only helpful person here so you're lucky to be acknowledged. Though I would think the chance to go to all the Blizzard events would be reward in itself. I'd let them ban me if I got to go to a fansite event.

[Joneagle_X]

Lol. The fansite events are definitely fun and worth the effort. I'm just trying to bring back what information I can.

As far as the Colossus I don't know what I haven't yet answered. It still does the same splash attack but it has a new animation. First the beam starts and goes left to right. Then it starts right and goes to the left. It's like it's swinging a lightsaber.

And I don't really think I have the authority to comment on balance solutions regarding bonuses. There are hundreds of balance solutions for any of these problems.

[MarineCorp]

Nice report! hopefully the Terran will be be changed a lot and blizz really do need to take another look at the Zergs

[i2new@aol.com]

Did you ever use the nomad and how did it play out?

What units are buildable with a reactor?

How about bunkers?

How about zergs ability to spam units? was it too slow??

What is making the zerg weak? early tier? mid-Tier? or late??

What do you think the biggest change in the Zerg needs to be?

What do you think the Biggest change in the game needs to be?

How about Reapers mine ability. How were they offencivly in unit to unit combat? Did you ever throw them during a fight??

How about this ability that the zerg buildings spawn units when they die?? was that in the WWI build?

[furrer]

AOL just for your information, a lot of these questions were answered in the post, and I think that it would help Jon if you only posted questions that hasnt been answered in his post or later (these can be seen in my post here on the board).

[i2new@aol.com]

Its hard trying to think of a new question and then go back and see if they were already answered. if thats the case just have jon Not answer the question and i'll go llok for the answer.

[kuvasz]

The logical way of doing it would be to read the whole thread and all the questions and the answers to them, not coming up with the question and searching if it's been answered :wacko:

[furrer]

AOL so you want Jon to do the work?

[Joneagle_X]

It's cool. They're not difficult questions and there isn't a pile to be answered. :D

Did you ever use the nomad and how did it play out?

Yes, I used the Nomad. It's back to its old model for some reason but beyond that there were no changes. It has the same abilities (turrets, etc.)



What units are buildable with a reactor?

Barracks = Marine, Factory = Jackal, Starport =Viking



How about bunkers?

Any infantry unit can sit in the Bunker and can use all of their abilities. Marine, Marauder, Ghost, etc.



How about zergs ability to spam units? was it too slow??

No, you can still build a lot of units. The cost is still an issue at this point.



What is making the zerg weak? early tier? mid-Tier? or late??

Zerg has certain units that are strong during each tier. They're not overly weak at any one point. I would just say that they're unpowered as far as air units go.



What do you think the biggest change in the Zerg needs to be?

I think the Zerg are shaping up as far as the structure of the race and the strategic options available. I think the Terran need the most work.


What do you think the Biggest change in the game needs to be?

The Terran need something that puts them more in line with their race identity. Then balance, balance, balance. But the game overall is very fun and exciting.



How about Reapers mine ability. How were they offensively in unit to unit combat? Did you ever throw them during a fight??

I used it a couple of times. Mostly I would raid and enemy mineral line and do a lot of damage and then as any serious response came up (anything more than just Marines because Reapers can easily handle Marines almost 2 to 1) I would lay mines and retreat slowly. This would force the other player to continue firing at my Reapers instead of the mines and would do decimating damage to the units pursuing my Reapers. They're pretty effective.



How about this ability that the zerg buildings spawn units when they die?? was that in the WWI build?

Oh. Yeah. That was there. It was dumb and hardly worth mentioning. It basically spawns a few broodlings which are very weak. They die after a few seconds so you can just run your units around instead of fighting them. It only has any impact early game when it might kill a few Zealots if they're unsupported. It's nice if you're losing, I guess. They kill Zerglings pretty easily but it's nothing special.

On a related topic (regarding base defense) I felt that the Planetary Fortress is a bit much. It's actually a viable strategy for a player to simply build a lot of these because one can take out a good number of units. Just one by itself can hold off around 12 zealots simply because the SCVs can repair it so quickly. It's really ridiculous. I had a player build these all over the map and it required my getting DTs to beat him.

[lurkers_lurk]

here is SC2 Source, with there own questions and answers, you might find your answers here, or think of a similar question because of a question that was asked.

Terrans section : http://www.starcraft-source.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3736

Protoss section : http://www.starcraft-source.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3737&st=0&start=0

Zerg section : http://www.starcraft-source.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3738&st=0&start=0

*note that they all start out the same way, just using a few different words*

im not asking questions because im depressed about my Lurkers that are right now useless T_T
my poor, poor Lurkers, i dont want to see its cut, they cant cut me fav. unit, if they do they will find out that i have implanted 7 thousand tons of thermite in their attic that ready to set off at any moment.

[Joneagle_X]

Lol Lurk, they're not "useless." They're just not core to the Zerg strategy.

[lurkers_lurk]

edited my post a little, termites lol, i meant THermite which is totally a different thing.

anyway to me the Lurkers seems pretty useless(it breaks my heart to say it) why make them when you can just hold out a little longer and get a unit that has more than 3 times the health, have higher armor, and also has splash? for just 50 more minerals and 200 more gas.

you might say that 200 minerals and 400 gas is a lot for a unit, but its better than using 750 minerals and 1k gas (thats 5 Lurkers), just to get 25 more health compared the Ultralisk ( im comparing Lurkers against Ultralisks) (( and its not looking pretty to me ))

specially so when all that changed for the Lurker is a late Tier placement, and more expensive in gas because of the Hydralisk

[furrer]

Check out this post, for all quesitons and answers (its done for now):
http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/showthread.php?t=5424
Overmind in this build they have bonus agaisnt armored, so they arent usefull against MM on the same way as before. Perhaps the only thing thats the same?

[Psionicz]

Are Zerglings too weak or are Zealots too strong?

[Gasmaskguy]

I heard Nomads don't detect anymore. Do you have to mass a lot of Sensor Towers and Scan a lot?

[Psionicz]

That further diversifies each race, so I'd welcome it. Its called extreme balance; instead of traveling to detect, with energy cost/minerals you can detect anywhere in an instant without danger.

[furrer]

GMG the Nomad hasnt been changed (BLizzard interview), so it shouldnt be able to detect before that either then.

[Gasmaskguy]

Still, I remember reading about it somewhere. I think it was an interview with Karune. He said that with the Nomad's detection, Terran were "detectorific" or something like that. :P A possibility is that they added back the detection right before WWI.
I'd like to hear what Jon has to say though..

[lurkers_lurk]

i do have a question after all, you said that the Terrans will sometime outnumber the Zerg because of the Reactor.

now the question is do you think it would be better to change the Reactor or the speed and the amount of Larva that comes out of the Hatcheries?
because that was the limiting factor for the Zerg, so they couldnt produce an army that could destroy the opponent army and base and still have enough to kill another army and base.

[Chax424]

Did you have a chance to try Immortals against Ultralisks?
Whats the best Terran counter for them? Now that it does splash I'm guessing it isn't Stimmed Marrines.

[10-Neon]

Did you see any interesting use of the Nullifier? Has it changed noticeably since the last time you used it?

Can you clarify what you meant by only ever needing a few Swarm Guardians? Is this just against tanks or do the Broodlings cause a lot of trouble with other units as well?

Can you clarify the mutant larva ability? Can they be moved around, or do they just behave like normal larva?

You said that the Nydus Worm is now basically the old Nydus Canal again- does this include the single-exit thing, or have they retained multiple exits?

Were there any interesting unit portraits, models, voices, that were new?

Can you give us details about abilities? Casters, specifically.

How does Creep Tumor placement work? Do you just tell a Hatchery to "make one here," and it pops up?

[Ych9]

Welcome back Jon. And nice to hear that you had an awesome vacation and time at WWI.

So I will cut the slack and not ask you 100 questions (Haha, u know that once you get back from your vacation, I will be MSNing you with 100 + questions so get ready :P).

So basically I will just ask you 1 simple question. Are you a Zerg or a Protoss after WWI? You told me that you kick ass with Protoss back in March's build. But now, the Zerg are getting a bit more polished, do you like the Zerg more now? What race are you sticking to in SC2?

[Joneagle_X]

I heard Nomads don't detect anymore. Do you have to mass a lot of Sensor Towers and Scan a lot?

Well, firstly, the Nomad still detects. I don't know where that one started but it's false. Secondly the Sensor Dome's radius is ginormous and it detects everything within it. It's so big that Terran players often take detection for granted and build only one or two and have no other method of detection. This is a bad move as a single sacrificed unit can eliminate a Sensor Dome very quickly. I routinely use sacrificial Warp Rays to eliminate them and send in DTs immediately afterward.

do you think it would be better to change the Reactor or the speed and the amount of Larva that comes out of the Hatcheries? because that was the limiting factor for the Zerg, so they couldnt produce an army that could destroy the opponent army and base and still have enough to kill another army and base.

No, I think there needs to be some other limiting factor on the Reactor. The Terran are simply producing way too many Marines. Then you throw in a 10 HP upgrade on the little suckers and it becomes ridiculous. Massing Marines in that fashion and that quickly does not fit the Terran race. It doesn't FEEL Terran.

Did you have a chance to try Immortals against Ultralisks? Whats the best Terran counter for them? Now that it does splash I'm guessing it isn't Stimmed Marrines.

I used Immortals quite a bit but I can't specifically remember using them against Ultralisks. But I can say they would be an excellent counter. They do a ridiculous amount of damage to Armored units (20 +20 bonus, so 40 damage) and they will only take five damage. If your opponent builds only Ultralisks and doesn't have too many Zerglings, then yes, the Immortals would be a great counter. But be wary of Zerglings.

The best Terran counter I found so far was Banshees. I can't recall if they have a bonus but they did so much damage to large units that they were very effective against Ultralisks. Tanks are also just as effective as they were in SC1, so Tanks are a good way to go as well. Marines do decently but as soon as the Ultralisk closes the distance they're all dead. Unless it's just that large a group of Marines and then this discussion is pointless.

Perhaps I'm approaching this wrong. Here's a list of units that didn't work well against the Ultralisk: Jackal, Marine, Marauder, Ghost, Viking, Thor.

Did you see any interesting use of the Nullifier? Has it changed noticeably since the last time you used it?

I think the Nullifier is a great unit. So good that it hasn't changed much, if at all, since March. I think it's attack damage might even have been boosted a bit. Just about anything that you want taken out of commission can be lifted, so it's a great multi-purpose unit. And at 50 minerals and 150 gas, it's like an early, early Templar. I used it over and over for lifting up Bunkers, Cannons, Marauders, Jackals, Thors, Ultralisks, Tanks, the list goes on.

But as far as interesting and creative? A couple of times I lifted off the pylons of a Protoss enemy who was cannoning. Not only does it make their defenses useless, it can also completely halt their production. The only downside is that the ability only lasts about 5 seconds.


Can you clarify what you meant by only ever needing a few Swarm Guardians? Is this just against tanks or do the Broodlings cause a lot of trouble with other units as well?

Anything that deals splash. It was great against units like the Baneling. You could attack a group and force the Baneling to kill itself for no reason. But what I meant is that the Guardian is way to expensive for the risk. That means it's better to build just two or three and cause just as much chaos without the risk of all that invested capital.


Can you clarify the mutant larva ability? Can they be moved around, or do they just behave like normal larva?

The mutant larva can move around like a regular unit but I didn't think to try moving them off the Creep. However, I think they can move off Creep without dying. They're quite quick but are a little easier to kill than regular larva. But they cost you no resources, just time, to build, so there's no downside to building these and it infinitely increases your capability to produce units at once, especially tech units that take a long time to build like the Mutalisk or Ultralisk. You can INSTANTLY build these units from a Mutant Larva so long as you had the resources.

A couple of times I used this mechanic to lay a trap. I allowed the enemy into my base and then popped out a couple of Ultralisk instantly which meant those units were in my Ultra's range from the get-go. I kept thinking that I should load these suckers into my Overlords (but you can't) and make insta-drops of huge numbers of Ultralisk with just a couple Overlords.


You said that the Nydus Worm is now basically the old Nydus Canal again- does this include the single-exit thing, or have they retained multiple exits?

Retained multiple exits. You can build a number of them and then you click on the one you want to exit and you hit the "unload all" button and all your units pop out, but slowly as if unloading from an Overlord. It's not all at once like you would expect.


Were there any interesting unit portraits, models, voices, that were new?

Not that I noticed. A lot of the new stuff seemed "dumbed down" since it was a public build.


Can you give us details about abilities? Casters, specifically.

Name the caster and I'll name it's abilities. There are so many casters...


How does Creep Tumor placement work? Do you just tell a Hatchery to "make one here," and it pops up?

Yes, you just select "Build Creep Tumor" and then place it within a certain radius. It's 50 minerals and builds very quickly. You can then select your Creep Tumor and say "Build Creep Tumor" and then place this within that Creep Tumor's radius as well. This way you can extend Creep across the map with just one Hatchery as the starting point and no drones.


So basically I will just ask you 1 simple question. Are you a Zerg or a Protoss after WWI? You told me that you kick ass with Protoss back in March's build. But now, the Zerg are getting a bit more polished, do you like the Zerg more now? What race are you sticking to in SC2?

After WWI I've changed things up a bit. Here's how I rank the races as far as progress:

1. Protoss
2. Zerg
3. Terran

The Zerg have made leaps and bounds since March. The Terran, if anything, have gone backward. I absolutely LOVE the new Zerg gameplay. I think they're weak only because of balance and I believe their new core structure is in place. They're not finished like the Protoss but they at least have a central idea to stick with and they feel correct.

So I certainly like the Zerg a lot more, and now the Lurkers are so high tiered that they no longer get in my way ;). But I think it's too early to say I'm making the switch to playing Zerg. I'm still a Protoss player but the Zerg are always #1 in my heart. :P

BTW Ych, you're down to only 99 questions. :P

[Psionicz]

You forgot my question.

Are Zerglings too weak or are Zealots too strong? Are Zerglings week because of Banelings?

[Joneagle_X]

Zerglings and Zealots are more balanced than they were in March. Not as much of a problem as it was previously, especially with the Queen being as accessible as early as she is.

[lurkers_lurk]

it makes me sad that you said that about the Lurker T_T.

The Mutant Larva sounds nice, just to clarify, are they built from the Queen, and how long is the built time / cooldown?

Every race so far have at least 2 casters, usually 1 Ground and 1 Air, while the Terran have the Ghost(Ground) and Nomad(Air), and the Protoss have the Nullifier, HTs(both Ground) and MS(Air), the Zerg have the Queen and Infestor(both Ground), what would you say would be the Zergs Air caster? the Overlord / Overseer? if so, do you think it fits its role as a supportive Air caster?

what were the abilities of the Infestor?(im hopeing that consume will be back )

adding to the previous question a little, was it worth it to infest a building?

how was the Warp Ray and Phoenix? they were the least mentioned units almost everywhere i looked

Where you able to use the Banelings as Mines? and if so how successful were they as Mines?

i keep hearing that the Nullifier ability Null Void was removed, is that true? and can you give us any more details about it and its other abilities?

i also keep hearing that the MS have an ability called Recharge(or something close to that) is that true?

do you think that the new vespane gas mechanic will stay in the game?

[Chax424]

Thanks! I can't wait to try it all out for myself...when ever that is


The Terran, if anything, have gone backward.


Poor Terran...how I love them so. I know they'll turn out eventually though.

[Psionicz]

The Mutant Larva sounds nice, just to clarify, are they built from the Queen, and how long is the built time / cooldown?
The Queen turns a Larva into a Mutated Larva as far as I'm concerned. Possibly 30 seconds but after that it can instantly turn into any unit.

[Joneagle_X]

The Mutant Larva sounds nice, just to clarify, are they built from the Queen, and how long is the built time / cooldown?

No, she mutates Larvae from the Hatchery. It takes about 30 seconds to build the Mutant Larva and then at any time later for the same cost it can instantly transform into any unit. There is no cooldown or limit, but the Mutant Larva takes up 1 food and is easier to kill.


Every race so far have at least 2 casters, usually 1 Ground and 1 Air, while the Terran have the Ghost(Ground) and Nomad(Air), and the Protoss have the Nullifier, HTs(both Ground) and MS(Air), the Zerg have the Queen and Infestor(both Ground), what would you say would be the Zergs Air caster? the Overlord / Overseer? if so, do you think it fits its role as a supportive Air caster?

I would think it is a combination of the Overlord and Overseer since both are so easy to obtain and none of their abilities are researched. Combined they provide a pretty potent air caster. Changeling, Create Creep, Detection, and large sight ranges are all useful. The Overlord's slime is gone, though.


what were the abilities of the Infestor?(im hopeing that consume will be back )

It didn't have Consume. It has Infest, Disease, and Dark Swarm.


Was it worth it to infest a building?

Yes but you can't just infest a building unless it's completely on its own. Infesting a building means the player loses control of the building for about a minute and it produces (ATM) Infested Marines which have a ranged attack, 30 HP, 4 range. They fire slower than Marines. But they're useful as extra units and to attack perhaps a lone building or expansion for free.


how was the Warp Ray and Phoenix? they were the least mentioned units almost everywhere i looked

That's because not much has changed with them. They have about the same strength and abilities.


Where you able to use the Banelings as Mines? and if so how successful were they as Mines?

Like burrowing them? Just like in SC1 I never bothered researching burrow.


i keep hearing that the Nullifier ability Null Void was removed, is that true? and can you give us any more details about it and its other abilities?

Null Void has been gone for quite a while. It wasn't in the March build and it wasn't in this one either.


i also keep hearing that the MS have an ability called Recharge(or something close to that) is that true?

Yes, it boosts the mana regeneration of casters in a certain radius. It effectively gives its regeneration to them.


do you think that the new vespane gas mechanic will stay in the game?

No, I expect them to find something more interesting. That's not to say this mechanic isn't fun, but it's a bit bothersome and requires players to get gas pretty early in order to tech quickly at all. This leaves players very vulnerable to early rushes.

[lurkers_lurk]

How vulnerable would you say Zerg are against cloaked units now?

Im glad to hear that Infested Marines once again comes from the infested buildings instead of Broodlings, how many Infested Marines were produced from it? and how long would you say they lived?

what units do you feel that needs the most balance / role changes? (besides the Thor and Queen)

did you see any new tactics compared to last time?

you said that the Devs. still thought that the Nydus Worm as a unit, do you think they will change their mind after a while?

do you think it would be a viable tactic to spread creep all over the map to make it easier to move your army with the Nydus Worm?

were there any critters? and did they explode? =P

were you able to try the Ghost as a caster killer? and how successful were they at it?

did the Overseer still have their expanding sight range? and did the size of the sight range change at all?

how would you solve the Roach VS Hydralisk debate(about where they are on the Tech Tree)?

you said that the BCs were overpowered, what would you say was the major cause of that?

how close does the Changeling have to be to the enemy before it shape shifts?

as of right now what is your fav. unit for each race? and can you explain why you preferred now compared to the last time?

[Joneagle_X]

How vulnerable would you say Zerg are against cloaked units now?

Hardly at all.


I'm glad to hear that Infested Marines once again comes from the infested buildings instead of Broodlings, how many Infested Marines were produced from it? and how long would you say they lived?

Depends on the size of the building. Supply Depots provide very little, Command Centers quite a lot. They last about a minute.


what units do you feel that needs the most balance / role changes? (besides the Thor and Queen)

1. Battlecruiser
2. Mothership
3. Hydralisk
4. Marauder (needs to be a little cheaper)
5. Marines (can build too many)
6. Mutalisk
7. Corruptor


did you see any new tactics compared to last time?

We will continue to see new tactics every time we touch this game for the next ten years as we become more experienced with it. I can tell you that the potential is raw and untouched even after 30 hours of play. The basics are starting to form but nothing is decided.


you said that the Devs. still thought that the Nydus Worm as a unit, do you think they will change their mind after a while?

They just didn't realize that it had been changed to a building because the change was so new, it had happened as little as two days before WWI. They'll figure it out even though its being a building is much less cool.


do you think it would be a viable tactic to spread creep all over the map to make it easier to move your army with the Nydus Worm?

Sure.


were there any critters? and did they explode? =P

Didn't see any.


were you able to try the Ghost as a caster killer? and how successful were they at it?

Yeah. It was great against most small units. I used it mostly against Protoss for its EMP ability. I did snipe a couple High Templar though and it's very effective. One hit kill if you can get it in range. But don't forget that Psi Storm is a one hit kill on your ghost too. It's like a shootout. Draw!


did the Overseer still have their expanding sight range? and did the size of the sight range change at all?

Yes, if you hold still its sight range almost doubles. Not to mention the Overseers range is larger than the Overlord's to begin with.


how would you solve the Roach VS Hydralisk debate(about where they are on the Tech Tree)?

Not sure about this one. I would suggest that the Roach be a mutation of the Hydralisk, sort of like the Lurker and become more specialized against ground units somehow.


you said that the BCs were overpowered, what would you say was the major cause of that?

Just a balance issue. Needs to be nerfed.


how close does the Changeling have to be to the enemy before it shape shifts?

I don't know what Cavez was talking about. The Changeling will morph to your enemy's shape from anywhere on the map. You don't have to be near the enemy at all.


as of right now what is your fav. unit for each race? and can you explain why you preferred now compared to the last time?

Tough to say, but I don't think my favorites have changed because of changes in the build.

Protoss = Colossus

Zerg = Queen

Terran = Banshee

I just like these units because they're unique.

[lurkers_lurk]

very interesting, you answered half of my questions, then you proceeded to ask yourself the rest of the questions that i asked you. hmmm.



Jon is losing his mind!!!!! it is the end of these forums as we know it!!!!

[Joneagle_X]

Give me a break. I'm using a 14.4K connection.

[mutantmagnet]

Thank you for the great commentary so far.

When you fought those Battlecruisers did you try using Infestors against them since they have the option to use either plague or dswarm?


Did you feel the Banshee were out of place to be used?

How are the maps designed compared to popular ones on bnet like LT and python?

Did all maps revolve around chokepoints to your main or were they more varied by lacking such a natural terrain defense feature?

What were the common army makeups you've observed at 10 minutes of play vs 20?


How does the carrier work out in any of the matchups?

[Joneagle_X]

When you fought those Battlecruisers did you try using Infestors against them since they have the option to use either plague or dswarm?

Didn't try infestors. I should have been able to overwhelm them without the use of a caster. But yes, it would increase your chances. But don't forget they have special abilities as well (Yamato).


Did you feel the Banshee were out of place to be used?

No, I think the Banshee is a great unit. Low cost and effective.


How are the maps designed compared to popular ones on bnet like LT and python?

Similarly. The only real difference that I see is some of the terrain styles and the new WC3 style Xel'Naga observation posts, which I think ultimately will be removed because they make scouting too easy.


Did all maps revolve around chokepoints to your main or were they more varied by lacking such a natural terrain defense feature?

On all the maps we played each player had their own plateau with a choke.


What were the common army makeups you've observed at 10 minutes of play vs 20?

Ten minutes is almost tier 3. So the armies are pretty large.


How does the carrier work out in any of the matchups?

It's very weak. Wasn't really effective against any units. It's also very expensive. Better to get a few Warp Rays.

[DKutrovsky]

Hey Jon, one question here,

How do the marine's stimpack work early game without a medic? Is it viable at all?

[Joneagle_X]

Yes. Marines are now much more expendable than they were previously because of the Reactor. I think even too much so. You just have to be more sparing with Stim Pack.

[BirdofPrey]

We have the medivac so stim pack use won't be as limited as it was in non expansion SC

[jamaylott]

Jon!

you said : "The Terran have the longest way to go as far as finding their identity. Right now they’re relying on numbers rather than placement or strategic strength to get the job done. In fact, at times it seems that they are capable of outnumbering the Zerg and it is the Zerg who have to then resort to splash attacks to survive the onslaught. This should never occur. The Terran need an interesting twist in their strategic mechanic to keep them viable in StarCraft 2."

I completely 100% agree.

The protoss have their mother ship, zerg have the queen, but the Thor has yet to set itself a real place.

I thought it would be most excellent if the thor maintained its original idea (or so i think it was at least) to be a mobile bunker, scrap the heavy guns (or at least save them for an upgrade similar to the BC, where each one is upgraded individually), give it 500 HP, make it cost 350 minerals 50 gas, and stick 6 marines in it. it will be usable early game, but not completely mass en.

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Also, this may sound kinda whack, but....

Taking the way the BC upgrades, i thought it would be kind of cool if a terran player upgraded ALL units which were 2 supply or more (takes, bikes, vikings, banshees ect) individually but at a faster rate, 45 seconds or so... just a twist or individuality.

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I am most troubled about the mutalisk however. The worm "splash" damage it currently does is very cool and if mico'd well can quickly overwhelm a decent sized, be it smaller, group of dragoons.

What if the splash the Mutalisk did was area of affect? the worm it shoots continues to Jump from target to target within a set area for 2-3 seconds, causing 1 damage per hit taken within that area.

The defending player, even though he may have more powerful units, has an incentive to move command his unit out of the AOE, so as not to incur too much damage, because rather than just being hit for 1 hp instantly, it is hit for 1hp 3 times in 3 seconds. So, if you have 10 mutalisks, their splash damage would not just be 10 hp extra to 3 different units, it would be 30. slow down its current attack speed a tad and it just might be viable fix it.

sorry if that doesn't make too much sense i just thought that ability would give it a little more juice, so that a player must better controll his army when facing a mutalisk swarm, rather than just watch his units stand still and easily deal with the harass

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anyway great post jon, thanks alot!

[Kaaraa]

I didn't see it anywhere previously, so here's my question:

Hatcheries have the option to build Creep Tumors anywhere within range, and Creep Tumors can create subsequent tumors within their range. Is this range a set range around the tumor, or is it the same range as the creep around the tumor? If it is the latter, does this mean that you could create a Creep Tumor across the map by making Overlords Excrete Creep all the way to that location?

Also, I'm starting to feel very confused about the damage system. Are they still using the Light/Armored/Building system, Small/Medium/Large, or some combination of the two? Do you (or Nikzad) know which units fall under what classification?

[Nikzad]

as far as I can remember, you can build as far as the existing creep has spread. as for the overlord tumor creep, i would think that you could do such a thing, but it would take a while, as the area they create creep on isn't huge

i really have no idea about the armor system, but i know there is light, medium, and heavy. not sure about buildings and stuff though

[freedom23]

The damage system is great imo as it forces you to be at a constant deciding stage of wether to continue your basic tactics and die or be very versatile at how you play. The only thing Im concerned with is Im definitely gonna have to learn alot about decision making if ever I get my hands of those and play against a very annoying player lol.

[marcusrodrigues]

Hey Jon! I have a question about the Zerg animations! Do we have a proper transition (morphing) between, say, a drone and the final building? From the videos I saw, there were only a blob that suddenly exploded into the final building, and I think it looked awful! Thx!

[Sensei]

Great report, loved reading it as well as all the answers!
Exciting stuff.

About Larva:

Is it still 3 Larva per Hatchery, and they spawn every so often?

I think I like the Mutant Larva aspect the most - since Mutant Larva is completely free to pull off and just takes time than whenever you have spare larva you should just be mutanizing them, right? And, does the Mutant Larva count for the Larva count (or does the Hatchery continue to spawn Larva once you make Mutant Larvae?)

[Joneagle_X]

Is this range a set range around the tumor, or is it the same range as the creep around the tumor? If it is the latter, does this mean that you could create a Creep Tumor across the map by making Overlords Excrete Creep all the way to that location?

It is limited both by a radius (a little dotted line around the Tumor) and by Creep. It can't be built outside this ring and it can't be built where there is no Creep.


Also, I'm starting to feel very confused about the damage system. Are they still using the Light/Armored/Building system, Small/Medium/Large, or some combination of the two? Do you (or Nikzad) know which units fall under what classification?


Do we have a proper transition (morphing) between, say, a drone and the final building?

Nope. The animations have not been finished yet, so there are no morphing stages.


Is it still 3 Larva per Hatchery, and they spawn every so often?

Yes, it's still three larvae per hatchery and they spawn intermittently.



Since Mutant Larva is completely free to pull off and just takes time than whenever you have spare larva you should just be mutanizing them, right? And, does the Mutant Larva count for the Larva count (or does the Hatchery continue to spawn Larva once you make Mutant Larvae?)

It's completely free except that it takes up one population count. So yes, you can do that but you must keep in mind that it takes up population. And no, it does not count as a Larvae from your Hatchery. So you can produce many more units from your Hatchery than you could have before. You could potentially build 6-10 Mutalisks from just your initial Hatchery.

[Psionicz]

I can see my self using that strat, sneak 10 Mutant Larva into a mineral line and make ULTRALISKS.