Hey i would jsut like to post a replay of mine and would like you too give me a few hints on what im doing wrong and what im doing well Thanks in advance <3
Produce a lot more drones not only initially but also overall. Think of it as a business. Drones are worth getting because they increase your rate of income. What do zerglings do for their cost? Defend and kill... but there was none of that in the beginning and you had a big army of lings, so they were essentially a waste of minerals at that stage. That money could've gone into drones and hatcheries. Hotkey your stuff by pressing ctrl+any number while the things you want grouped are selected. This makes army and economy control easier, helps to inject faster (though you still have to actually remember to do it) and produce more easily. You didn't spend what you collected. Erect an internal hatchery somewhere or expand and mass drones. Or an army, anything, just spend. You seemed to be behind in every aspect the whole game, and the reason was your 3k+ banked resources (and also due to the fact that I watched from your perspective... it turned out your opponent was just as slow). I liked your muta harrassment but without control groups you couldn't do more things at the same time. Roaches a lot earlier and scout more with earlier overseers. Lastly, you never GG first when you're winning.
Hi, Overall I'd say your weakest point is your early game. A better protoss would have four gate squished you pretty easily. So the first part of this is going to go over some general things to improve your mechanics like an opening build order, scouting intel to determine how you need to respond, and supply blocking. Once you can get into the focus of a game, you'll be able to move about much more quickly. Zerg vs Protoss can be tricky, but you generally want to put a greater emphasis on drones and scouting early in the game unless your intel tells you otherwise. The second part will concentrate more on the game you played, and some of the impressions I had while observing. I will attempt to tell you about the little stuff you could have done better. It's not quite as put together as the first part, but it's difficult to tell you about timings when your initial build order is sort of out of whack- so try to get into a more solid build order. TeamLiquid is a great site for build orders and the like, shoot me a msg if you want some (that goes for anybody). Part One: Consider perfecting some standard build orders for z v p, such as a 14 pool 16 hatch opening or a 14 gas 14 pool. Each play well but are geared for different results early in the game. The 14 pool 16 hatch is a good build opening for maps with larger rush distances, giving you the chance to flex with some drones as Kuvasz suggested above. It's going to be harder to use on maps like Xel'Naga Caverns. On a map such as Metalopolis, I'd consider the 14 pool 16 hatch. Then there's the 14 gas 14 pool. A very safe opening that will allow you to grab some speedlings early into the game to establish some map control and vision. Personally, I don't do as well with this build and have been practicing it more often. I would suggest it when you want to apply some early pressure on your opponent while working into the expo at your natty. It will keep you safe against some relatively small early pressure and give you some control. There's also the more rare 15 hatch 14 pool in z v p, but you really don't want to take your chances with this unless they have forge fast expanded. Step Two: Scouting. Your scouting needs some serious help. I can't emphasize enough how important it is to scout as a zerg player. Your play is dictated by your opponent. When you play in the dark like you did it's leaving you at an extreme disadvantage. Starcraft2 is a game of information wars. It's not like some little mistake in your micro or anything, it's game ending. Try to remember how important scouting is. Your first overlord floats into the nexus, revealing your position. You essentially give away information for free. Good players will put a scv/probe near the edge of their position to see your Overlord float in. Still send your overlord to the same position, only point it at the ramp position instead of their base position. This allows you a better chance to float in undetected and turn around with some intel without being spotted. A better player would have known he was close position and gone for a strong close position build. Your second overlord should go near your ramp to see if he is going to try and pylon block you (probably more rare now w patch, but they'll figure out how to reinvent this since it's so good). Move your first overlord from their base to their second expo position to dump creep to delay their third base. You don't send in a drone scout until you're way too late. You lost any chance at seeing his build early in the game. If you can get a scout in early you can see what kind of gas he's taken. Early double gas is telling you air or tech or something cheesey and sneaky like dark templars. Gas steal can slow him down and the sooner he trys to take it out the more you can guess he really wants that gas for something. Once your spawning pool is down make four zerglings to scout their ramp immediately and check up on them through the early game. Keep them alive. Good job on taking the Xel'Naga Tower. When you ramp scout seeing their unit composition can be a give away. If you see a good amount of sentries expect them to expand. Sacrifice an Overlord if you don't know what he's up to. You only want to guess what you are doing as a last resort. Your Mutas struck gold this game and helped you recover from your poor early game, but that was based on speculation. Same with all those lings, they were speculative at best. Don't get me wrong , there are moments where SC2 is about educated guessing, but your scouting needed real help to turn those speculations into educated guesses from the intel you gather. Step Three. Supply blocking. Supply Blocks really disrupt the game. Try to make some overlord timings. A good rule of thumb in z v p is to get and overlord on 16>24>30>40, then double overlords and even triple overlords into late game. Part Two You have a drone wandering around in your base looking for the probe. It's a waste of a drone IMO. If you can see the probe just let it wander until you can take it out. It'll just run away from the drone. It's still good to use a drone to patrol around your base if you lose sight of the probe in case he trys to do something tricky. But if you can see the probe, use that drone for mining. Gas timings: First 100 gas, ling speed. Next 100 gas Lair. While Lair is upgrading get your second gas and if you're planning mutas your third and fourth at the natty. Your second queen is way too late. Get that second queen going when your natty pops. Once the queen is up use one to drop a creep tumor to connect creep between bases and the other to spit larva, then go to spitting with both. Early game you had idle larva with minerals that could have gone toward making drones. If this guy was good you should have lost in the first 9-12 minutes of the game. You looked pretty bad early game then picked it up in the mid. All those lings bailed you out against that push he could have made, but were speculatively produced. Speculatively playing will make you lose the better your opponent gets. The ling muta build was a bad one with the positioning on the map. If he would have gone a good four gate you'd be dead two fold. One for not scouting it and two for not making the build to respond to it. I guess you could say you still won the game but if he was any good your lack of scouting would have killed you. I don't know, I just got lazy and don't want to write more, but my biggest tip would be to work on your scouting and mechanics along with variations in your builds.
ok, i -ll give yoy my 5 cents. The start is good. 9 overlord drone. Then, if you decided not to go agresive (maybe if you see he will block early), go to 14 and expand instead of the pool... at 13 when you get 200 min then pool and more drones. (this is my point of view ) You know he was north ... and he was going slow... you could have taken gold expannsion instead of your natural. Also too slow until second queen on expansion whole you had enough mins. Other thing ... too slow until you got speedlings ... and you could have gone for roach den before the base update you did not needed it still. Other thing .. at 7.30 aprox you did a good thing, 1-2 lings made him get out the bliocking units, and you started going to his base, but you a-moved ... you could have do normal move, go through his units with speedlings, get inside and kill several drones, slowing him a lot while you got stronger with the gold expansion i.e. Or maybe at 8.30 you could have gone worm and go directly inside his base with lot of speedlings, cutting down all his production (he has no sight in all his corners, with an overlord you could have spoted this)... if you got also 3 infestors with the worm you could have let them burried in his base, and as soon as he got full workers again kill them with spawned marines. Juts general ideas ,. in-game is more difficult to think all of them. and very important...at start is difficult.. but EXPAND CREEP. it allows you to see them coming, and they cannot build where creep is negating them expansions until they kill tumors. and of course, if you win dont be the first to gg.
Thanks for the helpy guys, took as many tips as possible on board All i need now is a lot of practice Thanks again!
ikkabotZ "Consider perfecting some standard build orders for z v p, such as a 14 pool 16 hatch opening" No offence to you but that is the most stupid thing i have ever heard in a build order. If the protoss walks around with a probe on ur exp then simple take out 3 drones to surround or atleast try to get him away, follow him with EVERY step so he doesn´t have enough place to build a pylon, just because he puts up a probe there it doesn´t mean you have to change anything, the safest opening against protoss is actually 15 hatch, 16 pool. If he does 2 gateway and skips cybernatic core you will see it if u scout and then u will KNOW he is going fast zealots to attack you. So what? At the time he is hitting your exp you already got enough zerglings to kill them, if he got 2 zealots dont build 15 zerglings...DONT waste MINERALS. Zerg cant build drones and units, they have to choose. So just build as many as you need. With 15 hatch, 16 pool you will end up having around 450 minerals when your exp is done, that means 2 instant queens and roach warren depending on what your opponent does, in my experience i dont build roaches early, i can easiely take out a 4 gate with speedlings, its all you need. Roaches are a saver choice ofcourse. Always produce drones, and this is the most important thing...ALWAYS have mapcontrol, ALWAYS have a speedling outside your opponents base, why? You will see if he is going to rush you and you will see HOW MANY units he will have, then you can think hmm he got 10 stalkers then i build 20 zerglings for starters. If you dont see that he is going out from his base DONT BUILD UNITS! Build drones, drones, drones, drones, drones, drones, drones...You will probably be scared that he will attack you, you will make alot more units then he will have because if he is making units you know he wont have the same miningtime as you, or even workers. If you constantly is getting up to 400 minerals without able to spend it up quick then build a macro hatch, and if it happens again..macro hatch. Without macro hatches you will not win, it is really important that you can get out alot of units at the time you need them.. I can tell you how i deal with protoss...I make 15 hatch, 16 pool and 4 zerglings..1 to each controltower and 2 outside his ramp. If i see he is comming to attack me i build more zerglings, and ofcourse spine crawlers, they will finish about the time he get to your base so its just to delay him. Gas at 15, just after the pool. And 3 workers in it and then i´m saving the first 100 gas to speed upgrade and the second to Lair, then you get your second gas, at the time you start building your spire you take both the exp´s gas. At the time the spire is up you will end up having around 800 gas, that is a strong strong strong opening. If you are skilled with mutas you will end up killing alot of workers, if he builds cannon towers, so what? He cant have a cannon every meter in his entire base, so hit the gateways, pylons, whatever you see and just run away if he comes with stalkers and continue. It will drive him into going for a big attack on ur base, then you just stay in his base with the mutas to kill everything. If he fails to finish you off when he attacks your base in his all in attack he will lose because 8 mutas in 3-4 minutes can finish off all workers, all pylons and everything he got left. And with the mutas you also get scouting. When your spire is done you should get your third expo and when you have harrassed him a bit you know he is going to attack your base, because it is really annoying to have mutas around so then you should have your hydra building complete and since you built your third expo and both gas in it you have 6 gas and saturated 2 bases atleast and 2-3 macro hatches you will be able to build up to 13-20 hydras at the time and it takes about 50 sec for him to get to your base so you will end up having alot more units then he has. BECAUSE you built DRONES when you should have built DRONES and units when you saw that he was up for something... That is how you play zerg, i also got a stream up when i play you are welcome to watch it. http://www.livestream.com/toolthezerg
I'm not sure how to react to your post. 14 pool 16 hatch gets you the pool up in time to place the spine crawler against a two stalker push while still focusing your econ. Pool first also makes switching to gas and cancelling plans on hatch if the situation arises easier because you don't commit to the hatch before having a defensive window to merge with the variations of Protoss early play. I also get four lings out for scouting sooner. It's a great adaptable opening that can set you up for strong macro. How does 15 hatch 16 pool handle early pressure? it seems like the pool is really late so if he pylon blocks you or goes really early pressure it could be worrisome since you're already committed to hatch. You mention three drones to stop pylon from probe but what if you fail? 14 pool 16 hatch can move out of a hatch to gas for a roach bust out since you didn't commit hatch first. I learned 14 pool 16 hatch from a ret and machine video commentary and i've liked it for a macro setup, but? Input appreciated. Can you attach a replay with the 16 pool? I'm not against learning any new builds. I like variation and it's intriguing to watch. I haven't seen anyone using your build in GSL. I thought building a hatch first wouldn't protect you from early protoss pressure so please explain and thanks. Have you tried 14 pool 16 hatch before and if so please elaborate more on why it is bad instead of just calling it stupid.
if it helps, lately my standard b.o is like 14 hatch 13 pool. If opponent is protosss sometimes I go 15 hatch 14 pool. In both cases i have enough mins to get like 2 crawlers and 6 lings to defend against early rush ... if he pushes then more lings, otherwise just some to his natural to quick harass expansions if needed with speedlings and start building the units I want (usually I prefer roaches and speedlings with infestors if he does not go heavy air)... which annoys me latelly are phoenixes so I also go early ev.chambers for a couple spores in mineral line if needed.
ikkabotZ, ok i will explain...If i see that my protoss opponent goes 1 gateway and then a cybernatic core i go 16 pool, the reason is of 2 things..1. Its easier to defend from 4 gate which cybernatic can lead to and 2...you get a much better start economy so you could make 2 queens and 1 roach warren at same time if you wanted to, getting both queens at same time is really important which you cant always do if u do 14 pool. The only time i go 14 pool against protoss is when they go 2 gateways asap instead of 1 gate and 1 cybernatic, 2 fast gateways always lead to fast zealots to get down your expo, but i still make an expo because i know that i will have zerglings ready, i know that i can defend my hatch. If you have to cancel your hatch, your opponent is in the lead of the game.. I also only use speedlings to defend a 4 gate because i want to save the gas to mutas, so i can get out 8-9 at the time when my spire is done. I also do 16 pool agains terran, even if they are going bunkerrush..It is so unbelieveable easy to defend it with drones, just to chase with 5 drones and get out the marines and then your pool will be done and wops u get 4-6 zerlings and wops you have killed it.
Noob Zerg player looking for tips Hello All Was wondering if anybody might share some tips for a big trade show I plan to exhibit at in a couple of months from now? I also know that there must be some good books on this. Any recommendations?
